Saturday, 25 November 2017

Death Battle Predictions: Batman Beyond VS Spider-Man 2099

Beyond VS 2099.png

Even as a hero’s era has passed, their legacy may still live on in those who fight for the ideals they upheld. In the case of one Dark Knight and another friendly neighborhood web-slinger, their battles continue through Death Battle’s next combatants: two heroes from a distant future who have adopted the names of those they idolized to continue the struggle against crime and injustice.

Terry McGinnis, the Batman from Beyond. Miguel O’Hara, the Spider-Man of the year 2099. Their namesakes (and two of their rivals) have entered the Death Battle arena two times before, so who shall stand triumphant in this third round?

Backstory

(Note: Due to the different canons in which both combatants are present in, we will be compositing Batman Beyond and Spider-Man 2099, which runs in contrast with how the show has normally done Marvel/DC fights. For Terry, his primary background detailed here is taken from his incarnation from the DC Animated Universe with extra information from his recent comic appearances in the New 52 and Rebirth continuities. For Miguel, he will be composited between his original 2099 imprint run and his latest adventures in the modern-day 616 universe.)

Batman Beyond


In the year 2039, Bruce Wayne had retired from fighting crime as Batman. Traumatized over his use of a gun to stop a kidnapping after suffering from a heart attack, he resigned and became a recluse in Wayne Manor. He had severed ties with his former proteges and the Justice League, as his old enemies had moved on, retired or died.

For Project Cadmus’ Amanda Waller, this was exactly the situation she had feared. After spending most of her life doubting the Justice League’s intentions and capacity to do good, she slowly came to accept how the world needed them. In particular, she gained a newfound respect for Batman, who she viewed as the most important member of the group. Waller became afraid as Bruce began to age and could no longer handle tasks that he would normally do in his physical prime.

To preserve Batman’s legacy, Waller initiated “Project: Batman Beyond”; by using a sample of Bruce’s DNA, she began plans to create a successor to the Batman identity. Identifying Warren and Mary McGinnis as psychologically identical to Thomas and Martha Wayne, Waller managed to use a routine flu shot to rewire Warren’s reproductive material to match Bruce’s own. The McGinnises would later have a son with Bruce’s genetic material, whom they named Terry.

Waller soon scrapped the project when she aborted plans to have Warren and Mary killed to recreate the trauma which drove Bruce into becoming Batman, and Terry would have the opportunity to live a relatively normal childhood with his parents and younger brother Matt, in spite of his trouble-making habits. However, that very trauma would come to pass when Warren was murdered during Terry’s teenage years.

Believing that his father’s death was related to Derek Powers, the corrupt CEO of the merged Wayne-Powers company, Terry attempted to meet with Bruce to gain his help; the two previously met after Bruce helped Terry fend off an attack from the Jokerz gang, during which he had discovered Batman’s secret identity. Bruce waved the young man off, and in retaliation, Terry stole the latest Batsuit to seek justice on his own terms.

Both men would soon come to an agreement; Bruce had come to realize that New Gotham still needed Batman active to stop crime and corruption, and bestowed the mantle onto Terry to do so. Batman was reborn once more, as the Dark Knight of Tomorrow continued his mentor’s battles to protect their shared home.

Spider-Man 2099


In one possible distant future timeline, North America was torn apart by civil wars fought between humans and mutants. The aftermath saw the social class divide became greater as mega-corporations such as Alchemax and Stark-Fujikawa established control over society. The Heroic Age once pioneered by the likes of the Fantastic Four, X-Men, Avengers and other superheroes had ended, and the dystopian future of Earth-928 had begun.

This is the era in which Miguel O’Hara exists: an intelligent but anti-social and rebellious young man of Irish and Mexican descent living in Nueva York. His smarts and talents earned him a job in Alchemax’s genetics division. He and his colleagues were soon tasked by Tyler Stone - the Vice President of R&D - to create a new generation of super-soldiers subservient to the corporately-owned Public Eye police force through DNA modification.

During his work, Miguel was entranced and inspired by one costumed crime-fighter from the Heroic Age: Spider-Man. Hoping to someday create an individual on par with Peter Parker, he gave the project his best try in spite of his reservations on human testing. After a failed live test which resulted in the subject’s death, Miguel was plagued with guilt and attempted to quit.

Stone initially agreed, but later revealed that he had drugged Miguel with Rapture, a highly-addictive drug which bonds with the user’s DNA. As the drug can only be legally distributed by Alchemax, Stone threatened Miguel with his influence over the authorities and a cure to the drug should he resign.

Rather than continuing to be blackmailed, Miguel attempted another genetic enhancement procedure on himself to remove his addictions. Despite attempted sabotage from his jealous subordinate, he survived and discovered that half of his DNA was replaced with the genetic code of a spider, granting him several spider-related abilities.

Donning a makeshift costume from Day of the Dead celebrations, Miguel realized that he had become Spider-Man’s successor with his new powers. Further inspired by Peter Parker’s heroic legacy, Miguel swore to uphold it by battling Alchemax and other evil entities under the guise of the new Spider-Man of 2099, leading the charge for a new Heroic Age to rise.

Abilties

Batman Beyond

Hand-to-Hand


While Terry does not have the years of experience that Bruce does is martial arts, he’s still a skilled fighter in his own right, having a different but still effective fighting style. While Bruce relies more on traditional martial arts, Terry relies on street fighting tactics that he learned during his rough years. Terry, unlike Bruce, has no qualms with fighting dirty (ex: his fight against the Joker). He often relies fast punches and kicks due to his suit’s flexibility. His skills in hand-to-hand were further enhanced when he trained with Kairi Tanaga. In terms of his weaknesses - as mentioned, he doesn’t have the years of experience and skill that Bruce has and he tends to lower his guard on the left side.

Intelligence/Detective Skills


While not being nearly as smart as his mentor, Terry has learned medicine, mechanics, and investigation from Bruce’s old files. While he has not been trained as a detective, he is able to thoroughly investigate a crime scene thanks to his above average intelligence. He often uses his street-smarts in order to get out of a bad situation. He can also use his cocky personality to taunt others into becoming more reckless as shown during his fight against the Joker.

Spider-Man 2099



Thanks to the botched incident which granted him the DNA of a spider, Spider-Man 2099 shares his basic powers with that of his Heroic Age predecessor. He boasts the proportionate strength and agility of a spider, allowing him to lift up to 10 times his own weight and leap distances up to 30 feet at once. His reflexes, stamina, durability and speed are also beyond the limits of what any normal man can breach, and his healing factor allows him to repair damaged body tissues at an accelerated rate.

Webbing


Miguel’s webbing is organic, shot through his wrist; its tensile strength can be controlled on his command and - much like the original Spider-Man - be repurposed into different tools and restrain other superpowered individuals. Given his half-arachnid DNA, Miguel’s webs are comparable to actual spider silk, which can be stronger than steel and kevlar.

Talons


Spider-Man 2099 can climb up walls with a series of talons which sprouted around his hands and feet; these are the only areas which allow him to stick to to whatever substance he wants. The talons can be used for offensive purposes as a bladed weapon, capable of tearing away flesh and even metal armor.

Accelerated Vision


While Miguel lacks Peter’s trademark Spider-Sense, he has a close replacement with his “Accelerated Vision.” With this, Spider-Man 2099 can see objects and people at greater distances with better clarity in comparison to a regular human. This also grants him some level of night vision, allowing him to see in near-total darkness.

Most importantly, this has granted him an advanced flicker-fusion horizon, which basically means he can perceive fast-moving objects which normal people would see as a blur. Combined with his enhanced hearing, this allows him to predict and dodge attacks. However, it is not omnipresent in the same way the Spider-Sense is; often, Miguel has to face an incoming threat and quickly process it before being able to react accordingly.

In some of his later video game appearances, the Accelerated Vision is present in a few different ways. Often, it allows Miguel to move faster thanks to his perception of time slowing down. This can manifest as an Accelerated Decoy: as Miguel can move faster than the eye can see, he can leave behind an afterimage for opponents to attack while he moves around undetected.

Fangs


Lastly, the spider DNA modification has caused Miguel to sprout fangs in his teeth, which secrete a non-toxic venom that he can use to paralyze foes he bites. This venom is potent enough to stun and even knock out a variety of foes, such as cyborgs, metahumans/mutants and Atlanteans.

Genius-level Intelligence


While he may not be a formally trained close-quarters combatant, Miguel is one of Marvel 2099’s brightest minds. As a child, he was tested to be within the top 1% of every person alive and was placed in an advanced program to maximize his potential. He was often regarded as one of Alchemax’s smartest employees before his resignation, and despite specializing mainly in genetics, he has extensive knowledge in other fields such as time travel, quantum physics, computer science, interdimensional travel and world history. This level of intelligence was enough for him to be offered a job at Parker Industries by Peter himself.

It is worth noting that although Miguel is guided by his own code of honor and morality, he is more likely to use lethal force if need be against his targets as opposed to the original Spider-Man. For example, he often goes for a quick throat slit to get easy kills if the situation calls for it.

Equipment

Batman Beyond

Batsuit

batman_popup.jpg
Note: We will only be covering the equipment that can help Terry in combat.

The suit that Terry wears is the final suit that was developed by Bruce Wayne. It utilizes servo-motors which were supplied by Peter Corso. The suit’s servo-motors gives the user superhuman strength (he can increase his strength further with the Neuromuscular Amplification), speed and durability, easily able to shake off attacks that would kill a normal man. The suit also has spikes on its arms as well as electromagnetic boots that allow him to walk on any surface and even upside down. It has the ability to electrically discharge itself to protect Terry from damage as well as shock anyone who touches him. The Batsuit has built in healing equipment to heal Terry when he gets injured, along with a lot of built-in weapons as well as devices that help someone like Terry who doesn’t have the amount of training and experience that Bruce has.

Heads-Up Display/Personal Communicator


Terry’s Batsuit has a very extensive heads-up display like Iron Man. It allows Terry to spot foes even when they are trying to sneak around in the dark, making it an excellent counter to stealth. It has Night Vision which means that trying to sneak in the dark and take the Batsuit from behind doesn’t work out too well for you, along with an Infrared Filter, meaning that it’s more likely to spot targets who are nervous as they produce more body heat. Terry’s head-up display also receives visuals from Bruce’s main computer, meaning that Terry can plan out his next move with the help of Bruce. His head ups display can also track and identify substances, and Terry has a personal communicator in his ears that allow him to communicate with Bruce.

Retractable Wings


Similar to Batman’s iconic cape, Batman Beyond has retractable wings which he can use to glide. It’s similar to an Airsuit in the way it works.

Rocket Boosters


These boosters on the soles of the Batsuit grant Terry flight, allowing him to be just as deadly in the air as he is on ground.

Batarangs


Like his mentor, his most used weapon are the iconic Batarangs, which are used for disarming people and cutting, and like Bruce he uses a fair amount of variations to them including:

Cloaking Device


This is a build-in cloaking device that makes it extremely difficult for people to spot Terry unless they are trained to do so. It has one major weakness though - UV Light exposes the suit’s cloaking.

Retractable Claws


These have been built into the suit and allows Terry to cling onto objects as well as cut through objects such as glass.

Grappling Guns


Terry has grappling guns that are built into his forearms, which allow him to quickly get to high places as well as be used to ensnare foes. He also has a traditional grappling gun that pretty much functions the same as his forearms grappling gun.

Explosives


Like his old man, Terry uses many different types of mostly non-lethal explosives that allows him to outwit his foes. Some of these types include:


Bolas


Terry has bolas that he can use to bind foes at their legs, tripping them up. There is also a electrical variation which shocks the victim on contact.

Wrist-Mounted Laser


Terry has a wrist-mounted laser which is strong enough to melt metal bars during the Shriek episode.

Buzzsaw


Terry has a buzzsaw installed on his belt that allows him to easily cut through glass as well as free himself if he is caught in rope

Laser/Taser Finger-Tips


In the comics, Batman Beyond can shoot out lasers from his fingertips which can be used to make a person temporarily blind by attacking their eyesight. His finger tips can also shoot out tasers that are powerful enough to knock an enemy thug out.

Impact Diffusers


In the comics, Terry got a couple of upgrades to his suit. One of these upgrades was special shields that he can create in order to block gunfire. Bullets will be completely halted when they come into contact with the shields.  

Lord Suit

When Terry went into the Justice League Lords World, he borrowed this suit that was built by Justice Lords Batman. It is an overall better suit than his original suit and has some new tech that helps in the extremely dangerous world of Justice League Lords.

Electromagnetic Shields


Terry can deploy electromagnetic shields in order to project himself from danger. He also has a variation which is specifically designed for Kryptonians such as Superman known as the Red Son mode, which uses Red Kryptonite.

Holograms/Visual Cortex Projections


Terry can create holograms to deceive his enemies as well as fake his death, which is what happened during his fight against Justice Lord Superman who apparently killed him but it was actually just a hologram.

Kryptonite Mode


This is a mode that is especially good at fighting against Superman. In terms of functionality, it’s similar to Lex Luthor’s Warsuit in that it utilises Kryptonite to damage Kryptonians like Justice Lord Superman.



Batmobile


Due to being in the future, Terry’s Batmobile is extremely high tech with an incredibly sleek design and flight capabilities, along with allowing Terry to remotely control it. The Batmobile directly connects with the Batsuit so that Batman Beyond is able to communicate to it to do actions and can be called to Terry’s location if he needs it. Its jet engines have been stated to be capable of Mach 3 speeds.

The Batmobile directly connects to the Batcomputer, allowing Bruce the ability to see what is going on in the Batmobile. It also has its own computer that allows it to track down runaway criminals using its radar. Like Terry’s Batsuit, it has been built with stealth in mind, allowing Terry to not be spotted. In terms of firepower, it has missiles as well as grappling hooks that can be electrified as well as be used to retrieve objects.

Spider-Man 2099

Original Spider-Suit


Spider-Man 2099’s original suit was repurposed from an old Day of the Dead costume Miguel once possessed. The suit is made of Unstable Molecular Fabric (UMF), a material originally synthesized by Reed Richards of the Fantastic Four during his lifetime and was made widespread in 2099. It is comprised of unknown atomic nuclei and electrons which Mr. Fantastic combined together: superpowered individuals who wear these suits allow them to use their powers with the suit adapting to them without the risk of being damaged. As an example, the Fantastic Four uniforms worn by the team can turn invisible, stretch long distances without being torn or be set on fire without burning away.

In the case of Spider-Man 2099, his costume allows the use of his talons without the risk of clothing damage. It also has a cape made of a light airfoil, which allows him to glide in mid-air; this was later upgraded to give him a more controllable version of flight. In terms of defensive capabilities, UMF gives him great resistance to bladed and energy weapons as well as certain types of firearms, but not against blows and other types of blunt force trauma.

Modern Spider-Suit


Since being sent back to the Heroic Age and eventually returning to 2099, Miguel acquired an upgraded version of his suit which does protect him against blunt force trauma, and is noted to be more durable than the original.

It also has the ability to turn invisible, mimic civilian clothing for Miguel to disguise himself, flight thanks to its thrusters in addition to the light airfoil, miniature wrist-mounted grenade launchers and can cast holographic illusions of himself to fool enemies into leaving themselves open. He can also apply these disguises or illusions onto other people.

If need be, he can use the suit’s on-board vicinity scanners to detect other life forms in the area.

Support

Batman Beyond

Bruce Wayne


The original Batman, Bruce Wayne created his superhero alter-ego after seeing his parents murdered as a child. He earned a reputation as a master combatant and tactician, in addition to being one of the most educated minds of his time. Due to his old age and failing physical state, he has since retired from active duty as a crime-fighter and provides support for Terry from the Batcave over the Batsuit’s built-in communications system.

Bruce trained Terry in the ways of combat and crime-fighting, and can advise him on the field thanks to the Batcave’s link to the suit’s visor. Bruce acts as a second set of eyes by pointing out paths and strategies available, and if need be can pull up relevant information on the current operation to assist those plans. If Terry provides a link for him, he can hack into most computer systems if need be.

Spider-Man 2099

Lyla


Miguel’s holographic assistant from 2099, known as the LYrate Lifeform Approximation. Lyla was created by computer prodigy Xina Kwan, Miguel’s ex-girlfriend from his younger days, and modeled in the image and personality of Marilyn Monroe. While she was originally relegated just to his apartment, she was later stored onto a holographic wristwatch when Miguel was sent into the present.

On Miguel’s command, Lyla can track enemies he tags with tracer bots and scan the nearby area for other lifeforms, often detecting other individuals faster than he can and processing any information needed within nanoseconds, even in a malfunctioning state. If need be, she can also hack into other computer systems to aid Miguel’s missions, and advises him on other plans of attack.

Feats

Batman Beyond


Overall

Strength




Speed



Durability


Spider-Man 2099

Overall


Strength



Speed



Durability


Weaknesses

Batman Beyond


Although the Batsuit does give Batman Beyond a lot of versatility, many of its functions drain from its battery power, and overuse of them could leave Terry defenseless. Its gadgets are also designed to be non-lethal, and thus unsuited for killing. While not a problem normally, it does pose a hindrance here considering how this fight has to end with a death.

The Batsuit itself has been damaged and hacked before even with its wide array of defenses, and in spite of his impressive training regimen and lineage, Terry is still very much human with no superpowers to his name. He’s not nearly as experienced in hand-to-hand as Bruce is, and tends to lower his guard on his left side during a fight, along with being very impulsive with his decisions, and often Bruce must rein him in to look at the bigger picture. Even with his training, he has also lost fights against more skilled opponents such as an older Damian Wayne.

Spider-Man 2099


Although Spider-Man 2099’s Accelerated Vision is an acceptable enough substitute to the Spider-Sense, it has a few drawbacks. Miguel’s enhanced sight means that his eyes are very sensitive to light, so bright light sources and weapons such as flashbangs tend to disorient him to a greater degree than most heroes. This is the reason why he often wears sunglasses while not active, and has shaders built into his suits to reduce the amount of light he sees.

It also lacks the omnidirectional range of the Spider-Sense, and thus can be exploited more than it if Miguel lacks awareness, although much of his equipment such as his scanner module and Lyla can make up for it.

Summary

Batman Beyond

2fa40287d3c960978786f3b775ce0d37.gif

Advantages:
  • Has formal combat training
  • Gadgets grant him more versatility
    • Flashbangs in particular exploit Miguel’s weaknesses to bright lights.
  • Bruce’s advice and strategy can keep him composed and focused
  • Visor and Miguel’s weaker stealth tech negates any attempts at hiding
  • New Batsuit allows Terry to continue to fighting in a weakened state if the situation calls for it

Disadvantages:
  • Loses the stat trinity
  • Gadgets are mainly designed to be non-lethal, and run on limited quantities. Most of those projectiles can be sent back towards him by Miguel, who has redirected ranged attacks before.
  • Most of the suit’s functions, especially its higher-end ones, run on a power supply the more Terry pushes it. Without the suit, he loses access to his enhanced physical capabilities and only makes the stat gap between him and Miguel larger.
  • Unlike Miguel’s suit, his has been destroyed by stronger foes which Miguel certainly compares to
  • Less smart and experienced
  • Terry is much more reliant on Bruce’s support than Miguel is with Lyla
  • Cloak can only run for a short time before the suit’s battery is drained, and his own attempts at stealth are nullified by Miguel’s Accelerated Vision, enhanced hearing and the scanners from his suit and Lyla’s own.
  • Miguel’s Accelerated Vision, while not as broken as the original Spider-Sense, still gives him many opportunities to dodge or counter Terry’s strikes and projectiles.
  • Even if Bruce found a way to hack into Lyla, she can still perform at high levels while malfunctioning; unlike Terry, Miguel is less reliant on his technology and can still use his own innate powers to fight on.
  • Has no real counter to Miguel’s venom bite; even activating the Batsuit’s electrical defenses may not work as Miguel has survived other electric attacks before.
  • Lyla could hack into the Batsuit and gravely put Terry at a disadvantage by paralyzing his movements and restricting access to the suit; worst case scenario for him would be having Lyla hack into the Batcave, sabotage it and possibly kill Bruce through self-destruction.

Spider-Man 2099

giphy.gif

Advantages:
  • Better stats put him at a great advantage
  • Smarter and more experienced
  • Scanners nullify Terry’s stealth
  • Terry has little to exploit against him barring his weakness to bright lights
  • Suit’s durability beats Terry’s. Notable as his powers are inherent where Terry’s strength does mainly come from his suit, and so destroying it rids Terry of his support and abilities.
  • Powers are more lethal and better-tuned for a fight to the death
  • Accelerated Vision allows him to see incoming attacks and react accordingly
  • Enhanced hearing may possibly allow him to hear Terry and Bruce’s communication lines and shut it down by destroying the Batsuit
  • Paralyzing Terry with his venom fangs leaves him open for Miguel to kill him
  • Is not reliant on his tech or support with Lyla as much as Terry is on his suit or with Bruce
  • He can redirect ranged attacks from Terry’s gadgets
  • Lyla can possibly hack into the Batcave’s computer, shutting it down or possibly blowing it up and removing Terry’s support

Disadvantages:
  • His own stealth tech does not disguise or hide him as well as Terry’s
  • Terry’s flashbangs can be used against him to great effect, although it is likely that Miguel can withstand a few attempts before he becomes more aware and plans a counter or Terry’s supply runs out
  • Is not a formally-trained fighter and relies more on his own personal self-taught style

Verdicts

Beyond 2099 Set.png

ramon_zer0



Obvious Spongebob joke is done. So about that fight…

If you cast your minds to 5 or so years ago, you saw Spider-Man kick Batman into itty bitty tiny pieces. Just this last March, Venom blew Bane’s head open. This fight is basically those same fights but in the future; basically, poor Mr. McGinnis.

I say that with a heavy heart since Batman Beyond was probably my favorite DCAU show sans maybe Justice League Unlimited; as a kid, I honestly thought Terry was cooler than Bruce as Batman and a lot of fond memories were spent blitzing through episodes on Cartoon Network some 15 years ago (god, I feel old and I’m only 22).

That said, Miguel’s probably my favorite Spider-Man who isn’t Peter Parker. Trade-offs. Anyway, a wall of text explaining why Spider-Man 2099 wins is incoming. Basically, to understand why he wins, it’s important to point out how he is basically Future!Bats’ superior in certain areas and more particularly, what tricks that he can counter:

For one, Miguel’s stats are just way higher than Terry’s much how their OG counterparts were; dude’s just faster, more durable and stronger - not much to debate on. More important to note here is that still factors in the Batsuit enhancing Terry’s physical capabilities far beyond what he can do without it, whereas Miguel has that stuff naturally.

Next, arsenals. Future!Bats has the larger arsenal but only a handful of those weapons are really going to work on Spidey 2099. Batarangs can be easily dodged, explosives can be tanked, nothing in there allows Terry to mess with Miguel’s technology, tranquilizer darts aren’t going through Miguel’s suit, electric and other energy attacks are things Miguel can power through, etc.

The only game-changer Terry has are his flash-bangs as they abuse the Accelerated Vision’s extra sensitivity to light, but Miguel is unlikely to fall for those attacks if Terry continues to fall back on them repeatedly, which also runs the risk of running out of supply. Flipside there is that Future!Bats could cut through Miguel’s webbing, but not only will Terry still need time to cut free from it if he’s caught - leaving him vulnerable, he’s ill-equipped with dealing with the rest of Miguel’s senses outside of flash-bang spamming or even the paralyzing venom if he can get one good bite in.

Even directly comparing both of their newest suits, both of them are roughly equal to each other in terms of AI-related features like monitoring physical performance and scanning nearby enemies, but Spidey 2099’s newer suit has the advantage of being much more durable than the competition. Case in point: in our research, I have never seen either of Miguel’s suits get torn up or otherwise destroyed, and he’s been hit with everything from swords to energy attacks which should have vaporized him.

The only exception to that was Miguel being stabbed by his girlfriend Tempest’s exoskeleton stinger after his guard was let down; this nearly killed him and while this could play into Terry’s hands, he doesn’t have the power or equipment to punch through it - given that Tempest turned into a mutated spider-wasp creature when she did that, and her prior attempts to do so by biting didn’t do much - and Miguel would need to not anticipate it from happening, which will be sort of hard to do.

Terry does have one trick with his suit’s Berserker Armor-like mode and being able to fight until he physically cannot, but it has been torn apart by the likes of Damian Wayne and future versions of Bane - combatants that Miguel could certainly compare to and surpass. Many of his older suits have been destroyed by weaker opponents with mundane weapons, and even Terry himself, armed just with Bruce’s old utility belt, managed to nearly destroy his original suit when it was possessed on the show, so Miguel destroying it is certainly in play here.

The Batsuit is also weaker in the sense that it does have a noted battery life; many of the suit’s functions drain parts of it, with the cloak draining power the fastest. Without it, Terry is more or less powerless to do anything of note against Miguel.

Stealth is by far a non-factor in this fight between a lot of different aspects both combatants have: Miguel’s ability to see in the dark naturally and hear a lot better than Terry, both suits’ extra vision settings like night-vision and infrared, scanners and support nullifying the other’s cloaking and other attempts at hiding, Terry’s cloak only lasting for a limited time to begin with, Miguel’s camouflage being less effective than Terry’s equivalent, etc.

There’s also the experience and intelligence gap to consider. Being Bruce’s son and protege, Terry’s certainly a well-trained detective and street-smart, but it’s nowhere near the level of Miguel being one of the smartest individuals in his timeline. While both Miguel and Terry have had experience in battling foes (or at least people close to them) their predecessors faced in the past, the overall higher power level of Miguel’s enemies trumps the foes in Terry’s rogues gallery by a longshot. Consider Spider-Verse as well; that alone should put his experience way above Terry’s.

Since both sides do get outside help - Terry with Bruce and Miguel with Lyla, the outcome is unlikely to change much. Bruce still has the smarts to guide Terry with tactics and make up for the intelligence gap, but neither of them have the means to mess with Lyla - her faster information gathering and processing speeds give Miguel the edge here.

Even if they did, and there’s probably a good chance they’ll find a way (on the grounds that they’re both Batman), she’s been shown to work at a very high level while glitching and won’t exactly stop her from providing Miguel with intel. Miguel’s advanced hearing as well as her own analysis should allow him to pick up on the Batsuit’s comms and work on a way to shut it down by literally tearing it apart, and even losing his support in the event it does happen doesn’t exactly cripple him and make him useless given his own latent powers to fall back on.

Lyla can also blow up other computer systems, and odds are that she’ll at least try to do the same here by trying to blow up the Batcave and rob Terry of his support in the most painful way possible. Given that the Batsuit has had security breaches in its programming before, it’s likely Lyla could activate the suit’s lockdown function and paralyze Terry that way too.

The only real advantage Batman Beyond has here is his formal combat training, but when the other guy has a suit that can almost do anything yours can, is faster, tougher, smarter and able to work around having his weaknesses abused in combat, it’s unlikely that Terry can pull out a victory against those odds. Even giving him his Batmobile - which is unlikely as Bruce never got his in prior appearances against Spider-Man or Captain America - only improves his odds very slightly when Miguel can easily dodge its weapons and rip off its armor plating before forcing Terry back to a hand-to-hand battle.

Also, just to reiterate one last point from the original Batman vs. Spider-Man episode: Death Battles being first-time random encounters with no opportunity to prepare beforehand means that most of Terry’s highest-end feats, such as his clashes with Superman, aren’t as applicable to him considering the extra variables needed to fall in his favor like the use of gadgets and suits which do not count as default equipment. If we did give him those feats and the opportunity to prep, the same has to be given to Miguel, whose intelligence - combined with Lyla’s - benefits him more in this scenario, such as being able to open time portals and send Terry to a quick death that way.

Trust me when I say that I had given every possible doubt in Terry’s case to try and get a leg up in this fight, but in the end he has little to work with here. In fact, one could say that any hopes of him winning here are beyond him.

...I’m a horrible person.

Tl;dr: Spider-Man 2099 wins by objectively being better in a fight.

Malcolm Belmont



So they are doing Batman Beyond vs Spider-Man 2099, neat - personally i want to see this fight happen a little bit later in DEATH BATTLE’s run considering that just this season we got a relatively similar matchup just this season in Venom vs Bane. This matchup is particularly interesting because when i was first researching this fight - i had this perspective that one character would win but after researching this matchup more and getting my head around the details. My opinion and thoughts switched. Originally i thought that Batman Beyond was going to win but after researching this blog - i have no doubt in my mind that the ultimate victor of this fight will be Spider-Man 2099. Now i am going into detail on why i feel this way.

Now let’s talk stars - first up strength. In terms of actual lifting feats - Terry’s lifting/strength feats are a little more clear then Miguel. The first significant Terry strength feat is that  he was able to lift a dumptruck. A dump truck usually weights (which vary between 27 and 35 from what I've found on Google) and that they hold 10-14  cubic yards of sand. After calculation this lifting feat came to around low end 43 tons at a high end 50 tons which fits considering other such feats he has displayed such as being able to lift a giant ceiling decoration and the time he lifted a construction beam. In terms of striking - The Batsuit is strong enough to easily break through a stone wall (this was when the suit was hacked an AI and Terry was forced to fight it but there is no reason to assume Terry couldn’t shatter stone with the batsuit). What about Miguel’s strength feats - well that is a little bit tricker considering he doesn’t have then many pure lifting feats - His best lifting feat would be lifting and throwing a new medium sized car which weighs around  4,009 pounds or 2.0045 tons but it has been stated that Miguel is able to lift at least 30 tons. So if we are going by pure lifting strength then yes Batman Beyond is stronger.But there’s also the fact that Spider-Man 2099 has faced off against foes that are much more stronger like Venom 2099 and a mercenary who didn’t budget after getting the full brunt of an 18 wheeler. Overall in terms of lifting strength i would personally give this point to Terry though others might disagree with me.  


What about Speed then - well in terms of speed feats.Terry has reacted and dodged bullet fire as well as outraced a giant wave of water and is fast enough to catch up to a speeding car in flight mode. Due to the fact that Terry is a clear bullet timer - that puts Batman Beyond at the very least in the Subsonic category or if you want to put it in simpler terms - Terry has Mach 1-2.5 travel speed and Mach 01-05 combat/reaction speed though in his Batplane - Terry is Mach 3 as it has been stated to have a travel speed of mach 3. Now as for Miguel, poor terry is completely outpaced here. The best reaction/speed feat that Miguel has is the time he managed to fast enough to snag a pair of small missiles mid-air and in terms of speed definitely scales to Spider-Man (he has fought Spider-Man before) who is Massively Hypersonic +. Both of these factors mean that Miguel is well into the Massively Hypersonic category which is Mach 1000-8810.2. As you can plainly see from the numbers - Spider-Man 2099 wins this category hard. Miguel simply has the superior speed feats.

In terms of durability - there is a very clear difference between the two characters - Miguel has tanked blows from 616 Hulk and 2099 Thor - who are two extremely powerful beings in their respective universes and even without that he has tanked an explosion far large than anything that good old Terry can do - this explosion destroyed an extremely large chunk of the building yet Miguel managed to tank it and he was completely fine. Terry’s best durability feat is getting a whole heap of concrete dumped on him and being fine which is not nearly as impressive as Miguel’s explosion feat.In terms of who would be able to tank the most punishment - i would definitely give this point to Miguel,

So in terms of stats - it’s clear that Miguel has the advantage. While he doesn’t have as strong of a lifting feat as Terry - he vastly surpasses Terry in both speed and durability and considering he manages to fight off Thor 2099 like strength (besides lifting strength). So what about other categories - well there is one category that Terry definitely wins at that it is versatility considering he has many more weapons,devices in his suit with the most useful easily being Terry’s flashbang grenades considering Miguel’s weakness to light. Besides that i really have to give the rest to Miguel - Llya is a better partner than Old Bruce Wayne considering it has more extensive hacking skills and has a mind of a supercomputer meaning that even if Miguel gets stunned by one of Terry’s flashbang grenades - it’s really not going to do that much.

I love Batman Beyond as much as the next guy but after researching this fight - it’s plainly obvious to me that Spider-Man 2099 has the clear advantage here even without the Spider-Sense - he simply has the better durability,speed,intelligence compared to Terry. Looks like Spider-Man 2099 is venom to Terry McGinnis. I am going to predict that Spider-Man 2099 will take the win.

Grand Blazer

2327238-1483240651087-Another_Natsu_avatar.jpg
Shoutout to RadioactiveCaffeine for showing that track to me.

Batman VS Spiderman Episode III: Revenge of the Bat. Maybe. It could also be Return of the Spider if we’re sticking to the original trilogy. Which we will be, for three reasons.

  1. RotS is the original trilogy while RotB is prequels, ergo chronologically taking place first. But due to this being a duel between combatants from the future, we clearly need to go with the trilogy that takes place second. So we get Return of the Spider.
  2. It’s a lot higher quality that way
    • (That’s for all the Spiderfans out there. Batfans can ignore this reason.)
    • (You can also ignore this if you for some reason prefer the prequels to the originals.)
  3. It’s probably the more accurate choice anyways since I see a better chance of Spiders returning than Bats revenging. Avenging? You get what I mean.

To be fair, this is another case of “Blazer wanted to make a verdict just because despite not really knowing the combatants that well”, so don’t expect anything good here, not that you should’ve even if I did know the two. But it’s a Spiderman match, and no way am I missing out on one of those, even if we’re bouncing from OG to evil to future on all three fronts and getting the same results each way.

I’m gonna start this off by going over what similarities it has to the last two matches. 2099 has the stat trio for one, while Beyond has the combat training and wider array of gadgets and weapons at his disposal. One’s a lot more reliant on their suit, its abilities and their gadgets, the other has actual superpowers. One’s been formally trained in a few martial arts, the other is self-taught with a personalized combat style. One’s one’s based off a bat, the other’s based off a spider, you know, the usual. Given that stuff, I think we’d all pull the same conclusion of “Spiderman wins” for the third time. But there’s differences to be accounted for here, like the lack of a real spider-sense that played a lot into Spiderman’s victory, or the Iron Bat suit that Terry’s got. Are these differences enough for Batman Beyond to finally get his team a win though?

Remember the episode number you’re watching here.

While not exactly spider-sense, Accelerated Vision is still gonna offer Miguel a good amount of chances to dodge Terry’s attacks or find him stealthing around, even with the cloaky boi up and at ‘em. And while Batman Beyond’s suit can probably help him even out the stat difference, there’s still a pretty big difference to be had regardless. The kind of a difference to allow Miguel to power through and react to plenty of stuff Terry could try, be it baterangs, bolas, lasers, etc. That includes the flashbangs too. Sure, they’d mess up 2099’s heightened senses and all, but he’s built up enough resistance to be able to take one or two first. Terry may try making a strategy out of using them to win then, but at that point Miguel would probably have figured out “he knows, he’s gonna try it again, gotta watch out for that”. And with probably the only saving grace gone, so are Batman Beyond’s chances of winning.

Apologies to Batfans that things are playing out like this for you again. Maybe you’ll have better luck when Catwoman fights Black Ca-

Or when Joker fights Green Gob-

Uuuhhh… When Spider-Gwen fights Batwo-

M-maybe we should just leave the Batman VS Spiderman fights here for now.


GuardianAngel1911


In the future some things change, and others stay the same. After digging through everything I could find for both Batman Beyond and Spider-Man 2099 I can’t help but notice that applies here too. Both these heroes are impressive and have proven to be worthy successors to the legacies of their progenitors, and Thor in the case of Miguel O’Hara. But when it comes to a random fight to the death, only one can be worthy to win. And as much as I loved and enjoyed Batman Beyond back in the day, I’m not sure I can in good conscious say its him.

Looking at their stats, Terry is far more impressive in the strength department than his progenitor was allowing him to lift, 40-50 tons at the suits peak power efficiency. Miguel, doesn’t have many clear-cut lifting feats, and overpowering the magnetic fields that keep magnet cars in the future on the road isn’t something I would even know how to begin to figure out. That said if we look at him fighting relatively blow for blow with Venom and Octavius controlled Peter you could probably argue he can scale to their strength which going with Peter since Venom’s strength varies depending on his bulk would put Miguel in the 50-70 ton lifting range (based on the time Peter supported a private jet).

So, if we take scaling, Miguel and Terry might be even, or Miguel has a slight edge. Without Terry has the more notable legitimate lifting feats. Miguel and his suits have proven incredibly durable, with falls at terminal velocity only injuring and not killing Miguel (though the Doctors noted the damage was severe as posted above), real fake Thor 2099 throwing him across the city via Mjolnir which impacts hard enough to drop a building on Miguel and he just walked it off, and between the suit and a webbing cocoon surviving an explosion which decimated a small city if knocked out for a while. Terry’s suit has been damaged by explosions and blades, and gets more easily damaged the more the suit is worn down battery wise, and speed wise Terry just can’t compete especially with Accelerated Vision giving Miguel warning as long as Terry is in his field of vision working as his variation of Spider-Sense in a way.

On the note of Terry’s battery issues lets look at their suits. Terry’s batsuit enhances his strength via the circuitry that makes up a majority of the suit and contains many gadgets, both for fighting and for detective work. On the combat side there’s stuff like electromagnetic shields to deflect projectiles or use as projectiles, finger based optical lasers in two of the fingers, and the more typical Batman gadgets as well as cloaking a full body taser defense an AI more recently, and a HUD with various vision modes.

Miguel’s original suit is made of Unstable Molecules and the more modern variant is Unstable Molecules bonded with Kevlar which is durable enough that according to Miguel nothing short of a Howitzer round can penetrate it. Unstable Molecules are used for many costumes and items in Marvel most notably the Fantastic Four’s outfits, and have unique properties allowing them to adapt to the wearers powers in the case of Miguel when he first put the original suit on it automatically adapted to allow him to use his claws without the suit being damaged, and spontaneously gained openings for his webbing to go through when he used that for the first time. UM’s have also been used in the creation of a supervillain data drive made from an F4 costume logo which was described as indestructible, although that moniker likely varies depending on the flavor of the UM’s.

Miguel’s more modern costume also includes several gadgets, most notably dial-a-yield explosives, tracers, a HUD with vision modes in addition to his Accelerated Visions ability to see things like radio waves and energy, and his cloaking, as well as having a wrist device containing Lyla his AI companion with nanosecond computation times. Terry has a clear gadget variety advantage, but many of his toys are either situational, not weapons, or things Miguel has encountered before. The finger lasers for example are something that many of the people Miguel fought had, though not designed to fry eyeballs specifically, making hitting him with those from a range unlikely, and up close he has to try and make sure Miguel is unable to avoid them and also avoid Miguel’s own attacks. But this takes us to Terry’s biggest problem, the problem of his own suit working against him as much as for him. Terry’s lasers, taser, cloaking, strength, survivability functions, shields, and other gadgets tied to his suits battery drain the battery at a rapid pace the more Terry abuses them.

While in easily ended fights or fights against street thugs this isn’t always an issue in more prolonged battles it quickly does become an issue. The taser notably comes with a chance to short out the battery if used at full power and disable the suit in its entirety. At is lowest the suit has been penetrated by knives, claws, fangs have torn the upper layer off, and even getting hit by a car. While it can take a beating at its peak energy levels those are going to deplete quickly against a foe who can push Terry to use everything he has. And, for a more direct comparison, Terry’s upper assumed strength level is comparable to Parker’s lower levels, Octavius in Peter’s body slashed Miguel’s original suit with intent to draw blood and couldn’t even get past the costume, and that was before the upgrade. Terry at the best we can give him is roughly comparable to average showings for someone who with intent to draw blood couldn’t damage the original 2099 suit, and now Miguel’s suit is even better. And that’s taking the lower end of Peter’s best feat to compare, taking the higher end would make it worse. Terry can compete in, and if you don’t want to scale, probably exceed Miguel in lifting strength. But someone else who has comparable feats to Terry’s best still couldn’t physically get through Miguel’s defenses to take a shot at his durability. And this will quickly be an issue as Terry’s capabilities lessen as the fight goes on and he throws everything he has into the fight, and that’s not even taking into consideration circuitry being damaged during the fight which will likely expedite the process. Cloaking is a moot point for both combatants, Terry’s bat sonar and sensors can detect Miguel, and Miguel’s Accelerated Vision, sensors, and Lyla will be able to detect and track Terry regardless, so stealth is not a deciding factor here since both have ways to negate it.

With the mention of Lyla though let’s look at their support systems. Lyla the Holoassistant turned AI and Bruce Wayne the elderly Batman along with (although the preview didn’t mention it) possibly his own AI A.L.F.R.E.D, who yes is based on the butler of the same name and from this point on just going to call him Alfred. Bruce is a wealth of experience for dealing with powered foes and an invaluable resource as fast as he can compute things on the Bat Computer, but he’s only human. Alfred is also a wealth of info and like Lyla can connect to information and help run and control Terry’s gadgets allowing him to help regulate his power usage, vitals etc. and potentially compete more quickly with Lyla. That said, Terry’s Alfred AI is more vulnerable, Brother Eye was able to download programming into Alfred that they didn’t realize was tracking them until it was too late, recently the prototype went crazy, and AI in the animated series once took control of the Batsuit.

On the other hand we have Lyla, who initially was basically a glorified Marylin Monroe Answering Machine based on his first loves tattoo of said TwenCen actress with a lot of snark towards Miguel. And then came the day Miguel told her to think for herself and she plugged into the entirety of the worldwide Cyberspace at once to download all the things leading her to go full-fledged AI and getting a bit jealous of Miguel’s then fiancé Dana (oh did I mention both Terry and Miguel dated a Dana?) and after an attempted murder of both by her it was revealed she had been influenced by a virus that was annihilating the entirety of Cyberspace, the Internet, and all the infrastructure systems controlled by such. After shutting her down, Miguel had her restored and she figured out how to cope with her feelings and desires, mostly by being hilarious snarky and a troll. But as the robot Electro of 2099 found, she is now fiercely loyal to Miguel.

So, Terry’s suit has been hacked, and his AI has been bugged and shown vulnerability on several occasions, where Lyla showed one vulnerable moment which, just turned her into a jealous clingy girl with attitude. While its to early to say for sure, and we don’t know for sure Terry will get his AI, Terry seems more vulnerable to cyber dickery than Miguel is. Particularly since Terry can completely lose control of his suit if he’s hacked while Miguel only looses the voice in his ear. Should Lyla hack into Terry’s gear and overpower, or even just distract Alfred she can ruin Terry’s day in the worst way by trapping him in his own body, or at least own clothes. This is an issue for Terry since, Miguel’s support can directly fuck him over, but his support cannot do the same to Miguel. And once she’s in his systems she can potentially take out Bruce via self-destructing the cave, and if Terry is given his Batmobile potentially hack and take control of it as well. Cyber-Warfare is a battlefield Terry Bruce and maybe Alfred can only defend on, sure they might be able to disable Lyla in theory, but they can’t turn that into doing anything to Miguel. Worse, Lyla may still be able to access Miguel’s time machine which allowed her to open time doors on command, while Terry did have a time bracelet at one point, much like his suit it came with battery problems. In theory Miguel could temporally separate Terry from Bruce or vice versa, or if he or Lyla were desperate as Terry rushes them open a door and drop him on a Nuclear Test site. Although like Alfred AI and the Batmobile for Terry I don’t know that this will be given to Miguel. If it is, its another weapon in the Spider-Arsenal and a potential counter to the Batmobile or way to screw over Terry in general. And Bruce has his own health frailties that could interfere with his ability to aid Terry.

So, the short of it is, Terry maybe wins, maybe ties, maybe loses in strength, and has a larger toybox. Miguel has the durability, suit durability, speed, senses, a support that is likely superior and his abilities aren’t dependent on, doesn’t have a battery on his stats(seriously Bruce buy Energizer next time), and could arguably compete in strength, and what weaponized gadgets he has are explosives more suited to killing an opponent. In the end Miguel is just an opponent Beyond Terry’s ability to deal with.

Imperator100


Thanks for inviting me to give a verdict even though I did basically nothing on this blog…

This fight has a bunch of fiddly bits, lots of little counts but….it’s pretty clear who’s gonna win.

I’m sure if you equalized strength, speed and durability this could be fun to debate but as it stands Miguel just brute forces Terry to dust. Terry’s a good deal stronger than Bruce is, probably in the MHS City Block Range...But he’s still not on the level of Peter or Miguel. He’s maybe stealthier but that really is not gonna give him any kind of big edge, even ignoring Miguel’s stealth counters.

The only argument, the ONLY argument I could really drum for Terry would be scaling him to people way outside of their league in terms of feats, which is clearly outliers.

Even ignoring the stat difference, Miguel just has better equipment and abilities for a fight. I am #TeamDC all the way, I love DC and almost always am rooting for their side but in good conscience this one clearly goes to the Marvel side. Miguel should clearly win

MarioGalaxyMan25

This fight has many factors to each fighter. Updated tech, how much can each combatant take, and some different abilities than their predecessors. Before the research I had my money on Beyond due to my previous knowledge of 2099 not having any natural Spider-Sense, just regular heightened senses, which I thought Beyond could take care of easily due to flash bangs and such.

But after a LOT of research, such as 2099 recently gaining a new suit and an actual Spider-Sense from the Spider-Verse event (May or may not still have it for the battle). His new suit can really defend against punishment, including an electric shield on a tank, which I’m sure is more powerful that Batman’s Taser-in-suit weapon. There’s also Lyla, an AI in his suit that also acts as sort of substitute Spider-Sense. 2099 also has extremely sharp talons on his feet and hands, which he uses to climb metal buildings and slash through armor and limbs with some ease.

Considering how much Beyond’s suit gets damaged in the show, it’s easy to assume 2099 can slash through it as well. The research also reminded me that 2099 has freaking venom in his teeth, allowing him to paralyze people with one bite, including the freaking HULK. In any case, unless Beyond finds a way to overwhelm 2099’s senses, like those blinding finger lasers mixed with a flashbang, I’d say 2099 might take this on stats alone. But like I said, if Beyond can stun him for long enough, I’m sure he could win as well.

4 comments:

  1. Interesting. My prediction gave Terry the win hands down, which I stand by. It'll be fun to see which of us was right. x)

    ReplyDelete
    Replies
    1. Some of his feats is doesn't make sense

      Delete
  2. Haha, you guys suck.

    Terry McGinnis ftw, suck it

    ReplyDelete
  3. I knew you guys were wrong for several reasons. Bruce's Batcomputer was capable of hacking some of the most advance technology in existence. At one point beings like Brainiac had trouble hacking him. Terry was clearly trained a few times on the cartoon. Bruce put so much into that batsuit to make this an easy fight for him. Spider-Man 2099 was never focus on combat for his suit or AI he created.

    ReplyDelete