Death Battle Predictions: Lex Luthor VS Doctor Doom

 

Green with envy. An old tired phrase, but no less fitting for these two tyrants. With money and power--both literal and metaphorical--and also the wisdom of science, even a nobody can become a nightmare. But when you can create or do anything you want, people will inevitably rise above to stop you, so you do what any totally sane person would do in this instance: build up your forces, point out your target to silence them and take over the world! OF COURSE!

...Wait, hang on.

Ahem, a-anyway. When it comes to delusions of grandeur, having a particular superhuman that is a nasty thorn in your side, and a desire to rule over all things because you believe it to be rightfully yours, these two mechanically empowered monsters with wicked god complexes are some of the most ruthless, cunning and utterly unstoppable forces of...well we’d say nature but everything they do is artificial.

Lex Luthor, ruthless businessman and enemy to Superman. Doctor Doom, the monarch of Latveria and archenemy of the Fantastic Four. Outside the ring, both of these villains have crushed countless under their heels to claw their way to the top. But without their company, country, or any manipulated underlings or allies to assist them, only one of these maniacal madmen can be shown as superior. Time to see who would win a Death Battle!

Background

Lex Luthor

“Must I remind you of my superiority?”

Alexander Joseph Luthor. Billionaire. Genius. Former president of the United States. And most importantly, a man burdened with a god complex and an insatiable hate for Superman, the icon of peace and justice across the world.

Lex has many backstories, but he commonly lives a humble and less than satisfying home life. Stuck with abusive parents and not much to his name other than his intelligence, he had to get away and start a new life. Fortunately for him, his parents died in a freak accident, one that he was responsible for. Using the money they left behind, he started his own company, one that would grow to unbelievable heights: Lexcorp. Situated in DC’s busy and bright Metropolis, Lexcorp was an absolute giant. It became an international conglomerate. Name any type of business, and it’s likely Lexcorp was involved in it, directly or indirectly. With it, CEO Lex Luthor practically owned Metropolis and much of the world by extension. So much so, that he actually became the president of the United States at one point. Lex would have everyone believe he was a handsome, selfless man giving back to all those who helped him, but in truth, he exploits everyone and everything under the sun.

Lex is a firm believer of social Darwinism, a narcissist, a sociopath, and before anyone knew it, Superman’s biggest detractor. When Superman came about, saving the day and inspiring the people, Lex was filled with indignation. Lex truly believed that Superman’s deeds would force humanity to rely on him, and as a result, become weak and helpless. And so spawned an absolute obsession with the alien superhero. He decided it was up to him to destroy Superman...and become humanity’s own “savior” himself. 

Lex got to work, designing numerous inventions, his greatest being a wearable suit infused with kryptonite abilities. In fact, Lex went out to seize kryptonite wherever he could. He became a part-time businessman, full-time supervillain. He’d try his damnedest to have a go at Superman, exploiting his weakness whenever he could, or exploiting others for his own personal gain. Before long, the entire Justice League were his enemies. Lex has gone to great lengths for power, ones far beyond what any man should wield. He views himself as far superior to anyone beneath him, and if it means growing his net worth, reputation, and capabilities, he will take any opportunity to walk over them. 

Now the megalomaniac known as Lex Luthor occupies his every day with a strive to become the absolute power in the world by any means necessary, and whoever gets in his way is a problem, a problem that must be removed.

Doctor Doom

“Doctor Doom does not beg.”

There are many tales of Victor von Doom’s early life, but what most people know as truth and what he’s made up are very different. Born into a nomadic gypsy tribe as the son of Werner and Cynthia von Doom in the fictional country of Latveria, Victor’s life had a troubling start when his mom was killed at the hands of Mephisto, the Marvel universe’s self-imposed Satan. Then, when his father was called to the leader of Latveria’s castle to heal the man’s wife, he was charged aron with murdering her after she succumbed to an illness. Werner escaped, however, knowing that the woman was doomed to die, and brought Victor with him. But not long after their escape, Werner died due to exposure, leaving Victor as an orphan. When Victor returned to his family’s gypsy tribe, he noticed the occult tools that his mother possessed and blamed the leader of Latveria, the Baron, for causing both of his parents’ deaths. Thus, he swore revenge on him.

While he grew up, Victor created various devices that mixed magic and technology together in order to protect his tribe from the Baron and his soldiers. This excellence got the attention of a woman named Valeria, as well as  the dean of Empire State University in New York City, who offered Doom a scholarship to attend. Doom happily accepted, and this would set him on a crash course with the man who would become his nemesis: Reed Richards. From the moment he met Reed, who was meant to originally be Victor’s roommate, Victor despised him, and would constantly try to outdo him. Still, both men were excellent students as a result.

Then came the day that would change Victor’s life forever. One day, he decided to create a device to communicate with beings in the afterlife so that way he could try and talk with his mom. Reed, however, noticed there were some calculation errors with Doom’s machine, being off by a few decimals, and tried to warn Victor, but he didn’t listen since the warning came from Reed, and thus he went through with it anyway. Those miscalculations, as well as the fact that Reed’s best friend Ben Grimm tampered with the machine to try and make Victor fail since he never liked Victor’s attitude, led to the machine malfunctioning. And by malfunctioning, I of course mean it blew up in his face. Literally. Because of this, Victor was permanently scarred on his face (though a single scar, it was still a mark on what Victor considered his perfect face) and he was also expelled from school as a result.

Victor, wanting revenge on Reed since he somehow thought this was his fault, ran off to parts unknown, travelling everywhere before he ended up unconscious in the mountains of Tibet. Some monks from the region managed to save his life, as well as teaching them their disciplines. Victor rewarded them for this by enslaving the monks and forcing them to build him a powerful suit of armor. He was so impatient to put the armor on that he didn’t even wait for the iron mask of it to cool down properly before he put it on his face, which not only scarred him even further, but also fused the mask to his face permanently. With his new armor and a newfound lust for revenge on all those who wronged him, with Reed Richards being his most mortal enemy, he took on the new identity of Doctor Doom

Doctor Doom would spend the rest of his days not just becoming a thorn in the side of Reed Richards and his superpowered family, The Fantastic Four, but also every prominent Marvel superhero, team, and even some villains if they sufficiently pissed Doom off enough. However, before he did any of that, he returned to his home country of Latveria and kicked the ass of Baron, throwing him out and installing himself as its new leader. He even allowed the gypsy tribe that raised him into the country now that he was a leader. As a result, while every other country in the world despises Doom, the people of Latveria genuinely love him.

Equipment

Lex

Warsuit

Lex’s battlesuit created for taking on Superman, this Warsuit has many origins. In Pre-Crisis it was an alien battle suit that was created on Lex’s home planet of Lexor (yes really) before it got destroyed. In Post-Crisis, it was originally a prototype suit designed by Lex, though it had the bothersome issue of driving the user insane. For his true suit, Lex managed to fix that problem by using Apokoliptian technology. In the New 52, Lex’s suit was built by reverse engineering Kryptonian battle armor and modifying it. This suit doesn’t actually have Kryptonite as a power source. Recent versions have been made out of Bio-Metal and can be stored in suitcases.

Though whatever version of this suit you look at, one fact remains the same. It is an extremely powerful piece of machinery that allows Lex to fight on par with some of the strongest heroes in the DC Universe. 

Augmentation

The Warsuit grants Lex massively boosted stats across the board. He has the strength to contend with Kryptonians, the speed to battle Lanterns, and the durability to take hits from the Justice League’s heaviest hitters. While his suit has been broken before, and has a definitive limit, it is still a marvel of technology housing its own armory of absurd weaponry.

Beams

The Warsuit can fire off powerful beams of energy. This is often his most used tool whilst fighting opponents in combat,  preferring to take potshots from a distance rather than getting up close and personal.

• Energy Blasts: These are standard beams of energy, strong enough to stagger high-tier DC characters such as Brainiac, Flash, and Wonder Woman. He can adjust the blasts to knock people out, stun them, or just straight up end their life.

• Kryptonite Blasts: This is his main tool when fighting Kryptonians. He can fire different types of beams depending on which finger he uses. Green kryptonite for his right forefinger, red for his right middle finger, blue for his right ring finger and black for his right pinky finger. He can expel kryptonite in large blasts, enough to stop Superboy cold.

• Magnetism Blasts: Lex can fire beams that magnetise enemies. 

• Electric Blasts: Lex can fire electrical blasts from his chest and hands in order to stun enemies or give other people an electrical shock. 

• Flamethrower: Lex has a gauntlet on his arms that shoots out fire and is strong enough to destroy stone.

• Mini-Rocket Launcher: Lex has a wrist-mounted rocket launcher, a perfect form of surprise artillery. 

Absorption

The Warsuit has the ability to absorb the kinetic energy of attacks (i.e. bullets, punches, etc.) and redirect them into telekinetically controlled energy blasts that become ten times stronger upon being sent back.

Forcefields

Lex has a forcefield that is passively generated all across the armor, including his seemingly defenseless head (he could have a helmet but he would rather let you see that it's him). This forcefield can hold up against the likes of Superman, Supergirl and the Flash. It can withstand planet level explosions, and also has an energy shield installed in the left gauntlet for even more defense in case he is overwhelmed, which are durable enough to block heat vision from a pissed off Supergirl.

Mind Control

The Warsuit is able to mind control others and even erase their memories.

Telekinesis

The Warsuit can project telekinetic rays of energy that allow him to grab heavy objects or people and lift them up into the air. 

Flight

The Warsuit’s rocket thrusters allow Lex to fly at unthinkable speeds, even through the vacuum of space.

Dematerialization 

                              

Luthor can summon his warsuit at any moment he wishes, with it materializing out of thin air.

Illusion Creation

     Lex is capable of creating giant 3D illusions.                                       

Two-Dimensional Imprisonment

Lex once used an invention to turn Superman from a 3-dimensional being to a 2-dimensional being. Though, uh...he punched out of it. It WAS imperfect, after all.

Melee Weapons

While Lex usually fights from a distance, he can get up close and personal with several melee based weapons that are designed mostly for killing Kryptonians and other alien threats. 

• Energy Blades: Houses an energy blade on his right gauntlet made out of plasma.

• Energy Spikes: Houses an energy spike under the armor of his right arm, possibly kryptonite.

• Energy Axes/Kryptonite Axe: Used mostly in Injustice 1, this axe can hurt opponents who have a Kryptonian nanotech drug called 5-U-93-R in them which enhances them to superhuman levels. 

• Energy Spear/Kryptonite Spear: Lex has a telescopic spear that he used in DC Universe Online to kill Superman.

Other Equipment 

Short-Ranged Teleporter

Has a short-ranged teleporter that can, well, teleport him relatively short ranges.

Satellite 

Thanks to his enormous Lexcorp funds, Lex has situated a satellite orbiting the Earth, equipped with its own devastating laser blaster. Lex can catch this beam and bring it down on an opponent in an explosion visible from space. It’s really just an enormous flex.

Sunstone

Luthor has access to a sunstone, a Kryptonian memory crystal.

Matter Transmuter 

                                   

Thanks to this device, Luthor can make not just himself but also other people intangible by transmuting matter. 

Kryptonite

If you’re gonna be the arch-nemesis to Superman, you’re gonna need a shit ton of kryptonite to do it. Luckily, Lex here has exactly that. They even come in multiple flav-er, types...we do not mention the pink one

• Green: The standard form of kryptonite and the most iconic one. This variety saps away a Kryptonian’s strength and can even potentially kill them if they are exposed to it long enough, though strong Kryptonians like the Man of Steel have been able to power through its effects. It is also extremely harmful to humans with enough long-term exposure, which Lex himself discovered after the kryptonite ring he wore eventually resulted in him getting cancer...oof.

• Red: An extremely rare form of kryptonite that causes unpredictable behavior and/or bizarre transformations to Kryptonians.

• Blue: An imperfect kryptonite perfect for dealing with the imperfect Superman clone, Bizzaro. It basically does the same thing to Bizzaro that regular kryptonite does to regular Kryptonians.

• Black: Definitely one of the more...unique variants of kryptonite. It has one of two effects, most commonly it is able to physically split a Kryptonian’s negative persona from their pure self creating two separate beings. Its second effect is its ability to strip away a Kryptonian’s sanity, turning them evil for a short time while also causing their abilities to weaken gradually.

As mentioned earlier, Lex carries these four types around with him in the gauntlet in his suit.

Doom

Armor

Doom’s armor is powered by nuclear energy and has an onboard computer that assists him in battle. It was magically forged in Tibet that had technological components added to it over the years. Technologically, it can fend off the hacking attempts of Iron Man. It is extremely durable and enhances Doom’s strength and speed. It’s an incredibly versatile suit as well, with a never-ending variety of gadgets.

Electrical Manipulation

Doom’s armor is capable of manipulating electricity through various means and techniques:

• Electric Shock: The armor can generate a electric shock that according to Giant-Size Super-Villain Team-Up Vol 1 can generate up to 100,000 Megavolts of pure energy

• Electric Field: Doom’s armor can create an electric force field that delivers an electrical shock with enough power to jolt Spider-Man. It also shrugged off the charge of a weakened Namor. 

• Electrical Surge: Doom can electrify his fists for melee combat. 

Forcefields

Doom’s armor generates incredibly durable forcefields. It is strong enough to shrug off antimatter, attacks from Iron Man in the Model Prime armor, and tanks thrown by Magneto. Doom also has a variant of a forcefield called a psionic refractor that reflects psychic attacks. Doom once created a shield around Latveria that was capable of turning unreality into reality which would keep out both Nightmare and Ghost Rider.

Time Circuitry

Doom has worked multiple temporal devices into his armor, granting him time manipulation. He can time travel, send others through time, reverse time, or stop it altogether. In fact, he has now become immune to time displacement himself. He even has a time cube within his armor with which he can manipulate the flow of time, reversing it or even freezing it outright.

Molecular Expanders

Doom’s gauntlets contain devices called molecular expanders that let him grow normally small objects into much bigger objects. It’s not uncommon for Doom to carry around small pebbles or rocks and then use the molecular expander to transform them into giant, people-crushing boulders. Though, as the name suggests, he can’t necessarily shrink objects.

Rays

• Standard: Basic laser blasts. They hurt people.

• Sonic Disruptor: The armor can emit high-frequency blasts for disorienting and crippling foes.

• Tranquilizer Ray: Doom can unleash a sleep-inducing ray with enough kick to stop the Incredible Hulk. 

• Nerve-Scrambling Ray: A ray that severely messes up the nervous system, to the point where those affected move erratically and have little control over their body. Or they can just be completely paralyzed.

• Finger Lasers: ITS MAHVEL BABY

Support System

• Life Support Systems: Doom’s armor has several life support systems that allow him to survive whilst under water through an oxygen supply.

• Artificial Intelligence Systems: Doom’s armor almost feels like it has a mind of its own with how it adapts to the user (in this case Doom). It has a guidance system in order to help Doom aim his shots as well as computer analysis in order to analyse the properties of attacks as well as magical spells (it can also automatically prepare magical spells. 

Teleporter

With a singular thought, Doom can travel the world as he pleases.

Misc

• Refrigerating Units: He has cooling units built into his armor that are capable of freezing Reed Richards.

• Temperature Control: Doom can adjust the temperature of his body armor from absolute zero to burning. 

• Hypnotism Impulser: A device in the palm of Doom that allows him to possess the will of others, even if they are inside a vehicle and not looking directly at it

• Super-Oil Dispenser: At the Index finger, Doom can throw a special Oil that can keep people in their place and can even devilish Sandman's powers

• Cloaking Device: Doom can be completely invisible to the naked eye.

• Illusion gas: Doom heightened Mysterio’s original formula in a combination of science and magic to make his victims see other things

• Knockout Gas: The fingertips of the armor can emit sedative sleeping gas.

• Thermo-Energizer: Doom’s armor can actually harness solar energy to boost its power. So...Lex is fighting Superman?

• Protection from the Undead: Doom’s armor actually possesses a piece of the True Cross, the cross that Jesus Christ was crucified on. As a result, Doom is protected from any vampires that might try to attack him, including some of the most powerful ones like Dracula and Morbius.

Doombots

In all his narcissistic glory, Doom has made an absolutely massive army of robotic replicas of his likeness, though none of them are quite as powerful as their creator. These machines, dubbed Doombots, are excellent decoys often used to trick foes into thinking they’ve bested the one and only Doctor Doom. Even a telepath would struggle to tell the difference between a Doombot and the real Doctor Doom. The stronger Doombots can even trade blows with characters like the Thing.

Despite being mere tools of distraction, these droids are still rather formidable in combat, many nearly on par with Doom himself. They’re even built with magical protections to defend against possession. Some Doombots are so powerful that they can even cast their own magical spells.

If Doombots are damaged severely and are on the brink of death, they have several features to go out in a blaze of glory, such as a self-destruct feature. Some specialized bots can even explode into a swarm of thousands upon thousands of Doombugs that attack whoever defies Doom’s will.

Swords

It’s a real-ass goddamn sword. And he damn well knows how to use it.

Prime Mover

The Prime Mover is one of Doom’s greatest creations to date. It is a machine that uses chess pieces to play with the fate of people to the point it can rewrite experience itself.

 

Narrative Freezer

Perhaps one of Doom’s most impressive feats he has ever performed in a more standardized setting, Victor was able to freeze Loki’s story down to a conceptual level, essentially pausing his narrative and freezing him in a timeless time and a spaceless space, something gods are generally unaffected by.

Inventions

• Inhibitor Ray: Doom has created a device, seemingly in his Doombots, that puts mental blocks on anybody trying to directly harm him. Without strong enough mental fortitude, one will continue to involuntarily stop themself from attacking him.

• Sub-Molecular Disintegrator: As the name would suggest, this is a small device with a laser that can disintegrate at the molecular level.

• Freeze Grenades: One of Doom’s earliest inventions as a young lad. It’s a grenade that lowers the temperature of everything in its blast radius, freezing it solid.

• Miniature Paralysis Gun: One of his less orthodox contraptions. It’s a cute little gun that can paralyze anybody it fires on. Great for concealment and use in an up-close brawl.

• Spaceship: He’s a hyper-genius who has an entire country to his name. Of course he owns a spaceship.

• Time-Shift Bomb: Upon contact with a target, this gadget alters the victim’s perception of time to be set back two seconds, meaning they do not have real time updates of the combat situation and are instead behind.

• Cosmic Power Siphoner: Self-explanatory. A harness that absorbs cosmic power, whether that be the Power Cosmic itself from both Galactus and the Silver Surfer or some other source. He’s used this to absorb the powers of Aron the Watcher with the Watchers being comparable to Celestials. Doom later built circuitry into his armor that would allow him to do effectively the same thing.

• Shrinking Ray: Created a ray that can shrink you to the point where you can enter the Microverse which is a plane of reality so small that atoms may contain their own universes.

Abilities

Lex

Genius Intelligence 

Lex is considered one of, if not the, smartest humans on Earth in DC Comics history. He is always full of plans that are geared towards taking down Superman, and with those plans comes lots of inventions he has constructed throughout the years. Luthor has solved complicated equations within minutes and holds a myriad of masters and degrees. Such intelligence has baffled even the likes of the Joker, who nearly went mad after he swapped brains with Luthor, being forced to comprehend how deeply Lex views/understands everything. Lex is versatile in almost all fields of intellect such as:

• Science/Chemistry: Lex is a gifted scientist, and has studied fields such as medicine, theoretical physics, surgery, bioengineering, and serums. He has created a vaccine for AIDS and has also created viruses, one being able to damage Superman and the other being the Amazo Virus, derived from Ivo’s creation itself (and then proceeded to create a cure for said virus in mere moments). Luthor’s science has found him creating/bioengineering enemies to fight Superman such as Bizarro or Hope, an enhanced human made to damage Superman. He's created several serums and experiments to help him combat Superman such as one that allowed him to emit kryptonite from his body or an invisibility serum out of aspirin, orange juice,mouth wash and parts from a radio. Yes. Really.

• Hacking: Lex is incredibly adept in handling technology, having built doomsday devices, armors, and weapons all of which with the purpose and intent to combat Superman, and as such he is able to counter such weapons or even counter other technologies with his own hacking expertise. For example, he was able to hack into and upgrade the Hellbat armor, a contingency armor made by the entire Justice League, and more impressively, he was able to outhack Brainiac, who is explicitly described as a 12th level intellect being, however, it should be noted that this took Lex months of studying Brainiac’s physiology to do so.

• Inventing/Engineering: Since the whacky ages of Pre-Crisis, Luthor has created and invented numerous weapons, inventions, armors, etc. He has access to alien technology such as Kryptonian or Apokolips technology, and has invented countless weapons with different intensive purposes. A small list of weapons includes an Apokolips bomb that can tear apart reality, an extraterrestrial matter detector, a kryptonite warhead & a scanner that can see into any period of time, a kryptonite mining laser, and entire laboratories.

• Businessmanship: As the CEO of Lexcorp, Lex has great business and management skills. He is one of the most shrewd businessmen in the world, a trait that has earned him an immense fortune second only to entrepreneurs like Bruce Wayne and Steve Dayton. At the height of Lexcorp's power, Lex Luthor virtually owned every business enterprise in the city of Metropolis.

Hand-to-Hand Combat

Lex Luthor is an incredibly formidable combatant, both suitless or in his suit. He has been trained in jiu-jitsu, and has taken upon training from Amazons as his personal trainers on a daily basis. He is even skilled enough to beat Nightwing in hand to hand combat and has held his own against Batman despite being incredibly weakened.

Doom

Genius Intelligence

Doctor Doom is frequently regarded as among the most intelligent minds in the Marvel universe, barring any all-knowing deity or the like. Typically, only Reed Richards’ brilliance can compete. His long history with revolutionary inventions, impossibly prepared failsafes, and boundless insight are proof of this claim. Thanos even keeps him under tabs, because a man of his intellect could be a serious danger. And Thanos is a supergenius capable of defeating even the likes of the Living Tribunal with enough prep time.  

• Ruling: Doctor Doom is many things that would be considered deplorable, but never let it be said he can’t keep his subjects happy. As the ruler of Latveria, he has made it one of the happiest places to live. Sure, he rules with an iron fist (somewhat literally) but he makes sure to cater to each and every need of his people, and is very benevolent towards them. In fact, in his conquest for the rest of the world, the panther god Bast was on his side, essentially confirming him as humanity’s true savior. 

• Science: Having gone to college with Reed Richards, the two of them left the professors in the dust with their ability to grasp every new concept pretty much immediately. Doom has performed brain surgery on the Hulk, could theoretically clone Loki, and discovered how to harness both vibranium and the Power Cosmic.

• Hacking: Doom has perfected robotics, as evidenced by the many machines he has forged to do his bidding. He’s even reprogrammed Ultron, one of Marvel’s most cunning and intelligent entities. 

Willpower

For a man with so much pride that follows his philosophy with so much devotion, it’s no surprise that Doom has an indomitable willpower. He once removed his mask, which granted him mental protections, and challenged the Purple Man to control him. After that, he just completely blocked his telepathy. His will is so strong that a gun that specifically drains willpower wasn’t able to affect him.

Hand-to-Hand Combat

Doom is incredibly adept in close quarters combat. He’s proven a match for some of Marvel’s best fighters, like Captain America and Daredevil. A powerless and armorless Doom was able to defeat Taskmaster, who literally has the power to predict every move his opponent makes. Captain America has even said that without his armor, Doom is still a match for him. It’s implied he was trained under the monks of Tibet. He’s trained under some of the best fencing masters on Earth and can even beat Black Panther in a fight.

Magical Ability

Victor’s technological talent is some of the most impressive in fiction, but even that can’t compare to his ultimate trump card: the befuddling powers of magic. Doom is one of the most proficient and dangerous users of the mystic arts in the Marvel universe. In fact, he knows spells that Doctor Strange does not, and this is because he’s dabbled in the dark arts for centuries. Doom’s magic is so potent that Wanda Maximoff, the Scarlet Witch, stated that his magic is more powerful than both her magic and Doctor Strange’s.

Doom’s magic is so potent that he can even defeat the trickster god Loki in a magical duel, in which he states that magic is essentially imposing a higher narrative into reality, imposing a story, a fiction into reality and willing it to become true. To be a creature of magic is to be a creature of story. Victor Von Doom isn’t just a person or a doombot. He isn’t merely physical. He’s the Story of Doctor Doom itself. He’s a creature of magic. A creature of story.

Spells

• Crimson Bands of Cyttorak: This technique calls upon the power of the magical deity Cyttorak to summon bands of energy that are practically unbreakable without godlike strength.

• Flames of the Faltine: The Flames of the Faltine are mystical fires invoked by calling upon the Faltine. They’ve been described to be powerful enough to burn and potentially kill even the Celestials.

• Images of Ikkon: Calls upon Ikkon to create illusionary duplicates of himself.

• Seven Suns of Cinnibus: Calls upon the blinding lights of Cinnibus. Doom has used this ability to temporarily incapacitate Blue Marvel.

• Bolts of Balthakk: Invokes Balthakk to dish out powerful electrical attacks. 

• Magical Blasts: Offensive blasts of magical energy with enough kick to harm the strongest of foes.

• Magical Shield: Doom is able to create a magic shield to block Morgan Le Fay's attacks. Morgan is one of the strongest magical users in the Marvel Universe, being capable of erasing Sentry across all of time

• Magical Healing: Healing magic potent enough to restore body parts, like the time Skaar cut off his arm. He can also use magical healing to heal other people 

• Magical Teleport: Doom can teleport instantly out of his armor.

Elemental Manipulation

Doom has control over the fundamental elements of nature. He can shoot out bursts of flame, call forth blizzards in an instant, summon vortexes, and of course dish out blasts of lightning.

 

Immortality

Due to his destiny of becoming Death’s greatest servant, Doom essentially granted a form of immortality my Mistress Death herself. Even before this however, Doom’s hate was so strong that it kept him alive after his blood was turned into acid and his heart into stone by the Marquis of Death. His atoms began to die. Even after he was dropped millions of years into the past without his powers to be killed by Megladon sharks, he survived, learning sorcery from that point on and returned to the present by waiting in order to get revenge on his master. This was soft retconned later, although the retcon did not impact his ability to keep himself alive after being attacked down to the atomic level.

 

Misc

• Energy Absorption: He can absorb the energy of other people as well as absorb energy from energy based attacks via his armor circuitry. He has even absorbed the Power Cosmic from a Power Cosmic amped Hulk robot. A single lightning strike from Thor allowed him to absorb enough of the Odinforce from Mjolnir to power his own Destroyer armor

• Energy Transmutation: Doom can convert matter into energy, even doing so to abstract beings such as Nightmare

• Absorption: Absorbed Nightmare into himself after converting him into energy

• Power Nullification: Doom can completely cancel out the powers of others

• Summoning: Doom can summon an army of otherworldly creatures to aid him in battle, such as an army of Mindless Ones.

• Force Fields: He has magical force fields that allow him to block attacks from magical users such as Morgan Le Fay

• Healing: He can use magic to heal other people as shown he healed Wiccan of his injuries. 

• Time Travel: He can travel back in time as well as send other people through time as shown when he forced Morgan Le Fay to time travel back to 1 Million BC

• Dimensional Travel: Doom can travel between dimensions freely, and even send others to different dimensions. He can even enter the higher plane of reality known as Gutterspace which views events of the multiverse as mere comic panels.

• Exorcism: He has exorcise spirits out of other people as well as himself. 

• Telepathy: Doom has trapped Rachel Summers, an already Omega Level telepath in an infinite, mental encephalo-hologram WHILE she was amped with the Phoenix Force.

• Telepathic Protection: He has shields that protect himself from mind hax as shown when he protected his mind against Red Onslaught 

• Anti-Possession: He can dispel others from possessing him. 

Ovoid Mind Transfer

Taught to him by the alien race known as the Ovoids, this allows Doom to switch his mind with another nearby person’s by making eye contact. Reed Richards himself has described it as. “moving your mind into another body because yours is broken”. Doom is so advanced with this technique, he can even perform it as a spirit. 

Feats

Lex

Overall

• Discovered the Anti-Life Equation (see above)

• One of the smartest minds in the DC universe: declared to be a 12th level intellect

• Founding leader of the Legion of Doom.

• Became president of the United States of America

• Killed his superpowered Earth-3 counterpart Mazahs

• Discovered the secret identity of Batman

• Took control of the Zone Child

• Became an Orange Lantern to stop Blackest Night

• Eventually joined the Justice League

• Stole 40 cakes (as many as four tens) and that’s terrible

Power

• Has contended with numerous heavy hitters in DC, which mostly include Kryptonians

• Snapped Brainiac’s neck (shown above)

• Drew blood from Supergirl and knocked her onto the ground (Kryptonite)

• A clash with Superman caused large geographical damage

• Teenage Lex one-shotted depowered Superboy.

• The earliest version of his Warsuit can stagger Superdoom, an alternate universe Superman

• Thoroughly beat the shit out of Superman (Red Solar Radiation)

• Tackled Superman through the Earth’s crust

• Evenly traded blows with Superman

• Blasted Wonder Woman and Flash

• Harmed Firestorm 

• Somewhat comparable to Green Lantern Kyle Rayner, who could contain the Big Bang.

• A prototype warsuit once fought Sinestro

• Blasted an island sized meteor into Earth

• Blew up an entire cargo ship in one blast

• One-shot Starfire and Beast Boy at once

• Temporarily knocked out Starfire with a laser from his suit

• Decapitated a Brainiac probe with a single strike

• Brainiac probes are strong enough to match and kill Kryptonians (Red solar radiation)

Speed

• Can dodge point-blank shots without his suit (shown above)

• Regularly keeps pace with a suppressed Superman in their fights, multiple times. 

• Superman was able to fly from Vega to Earth in a short amount of time.

• Can react to Wonder Woman, who can block the pieces of the Shattered God (52 quintillion - 315 quintillion c)

• Reacts to Supergirl’s attacks and gains the edge in their fight

• The Warsuit on its own was able to fly fast enough to catch Lex before he hit the ground

• Reacted to Larfleeze’s attempt to blitz him

• Larfleeze should be on the level of Green Lanterns, who can fight Blue Beetle. Blue Beetle fought and defeated Omac Prime, who absorbed the powers of Captain Atom

• Hal and Guy could cross the universe in about 10 hours while their rings are on standby mode (87 quadrillion c)

• Can tag Flash, who can process events that last less than an attosecond. 

Durability

• Blocked an attack from Larfleeze who is a one man Lantern Corps (though he didn’t have his power battery at the time, making him slightly weaker)

• Shield projector can tank a bloodlusted Supergirl's heat vision

• No-sold heat vision from an evil Supergirl

• Was kicked in the face by Black Canary without his suit on

• Was fine after falling from a pretty big height

• Tanked a weakened Superman’s heat vision

• Tanked a planet exploding in his face after having just about the worst day one could have

• Tanked heat vision from Superman

• Tanked hits from sundipped Superman who is a more powerful version of Superman.

• Tanked attacks from Ultraman who is the Earth 3 Version of Superman

• Withstood several hits from the Flash

• Tanked a punch from Apokalips Superman

• Survived several attacks from a bloodlusted Alexander Luthor, who has the power of Shazam

• Survived the entirety of the Omega Effect possessing his body, and became the New God of Entropy

• Forcefield was unscathed from a starbolt shot by Starfire

Doom

Overall

• Defeated almost every character in the Marvel Universe at some point in their lives

• He has earned the respect of many villains like Magneto, Thanos, M.O.D.O.K., Akhenaten, and others

• Beat Loki in a magical duel

• Doom transformed his body into such a state that not even a molecule of him betrayed him when needed most

• Resisted Zebediah Kilgrave’s mind control (while Kilgrave was amped to a planetary scale) with his will alone

• Emma Frost can’t enter his mind and Emma can telepathically ragdoll Nate Grey 

• Can keep his physical form together via his mind

• His will is so strong that he resisted a blast from a gun that drains willpower entirely

• His armor blocked hacking from Extremis Iron Man, who later on, could biologically hack into a Celestial using an Extremis infected symbiote (it is possible that Tony became a better hacker)

• Fought an army of Celestials for 5 years straight

• He took over the world twice but then got bored 

• Didn't find worth in being a god 

• Talks down the Beyonders, saying he’s destroyed planets and universes to mock them

• Destroyed an entire universe because his alternate universe self was friends with Reed

• Temporarily took on the mantle of Iron Man from Tony Stark after Civil War II

• Has a pet tiger faster than the Fantastic Four

• Held his own in 2099

Power

• Broke a titanium net

• Handled Black Panther

• Knocked out Iron Man in one hit

• Easily dispatched his own Doombots 

• Can contend with the Thing’s brute force, who should be comparable to Grey Hulk smashing an asteroid twice the size of Earth (169 Zettatons)

• Could overpower Penance

• Can fight on par with Thor who can shake the stars while wielding two mjolnirs

• Thor has been compared to Silver Surfer in strength before, and was able to dent his forehead while Surfer was suppressed; Silver Surfer can cause supernovas by flying through Stars

• Can go toe to toe with Extremis Iron Man 

• Can fight on par with Mephisto (likely amped with metaphysical magic) which is rather impressive as Mephisto is highly resistant to physical assault

• Mephisto’s clash with Satannish threatens to destroy the main mortal universe, Mephisto’s realm, and the dimension they were fighting in

• Mephisto is comparable to Hela and Odin; Odin could nullify Surtur’s flames that would’ve been capable of destroying Yggdrasil, which exists in the infinite planes of reality

• Hela and Mephisto’s clash was compared to Ragnarok, which is the destruction of Yggdrasil

• Can match Hulk and make him bleed with a punch

• Hulk has defeated Hyperion before, who can tank the incursion of two universes colliding

• Doom is a physical match for Blue Marvel, although this is likely when he’s amped by magic

Speed

• Reacted to M.O.D.O.K.’s mind beams

• Can keep up with Human Torch in combat

• Far superior to Iron Man, who can react to and perceive things within picoseconds

• Can react to Hulk, twice

• Can keep pace with the Thing

• Consistently keeps up with members of the Fantastic Four

• Can tag White Vision and Sandman

• Can keep up with Susan Storm, who can react to an attack from Galactus

• Comparable to a suppressed Silver Surfer, who can travel half a million light years in a short time frame (300 billion c - 3 trillion c)

• Quick enough to deflect Mjolnir. Mjolnir is capable of traveling from Earth to Asgard and back in roughly a minute. Asgard is described as a universe away (525.91 quadrillion -1.05 quintillion c). Keep in mind that this feat was performed in Thor’s 3rd official appearance.

• Thor also managed to cross a universe after hearing a prayer (6.32 quintillion - 12.63 quintillion c using 5 seconds, 4.64 quintillion - 9.28 quintillion)

Durability

• Routinely takes hits from the likes of the Fantastic Four

• Survived two high explosive missiles detonating in front of him

• Threw himself over an atomic grenade to protect his people

• Tanked Storm’s lightning 

• Forcefield denies Cyclops’ optic blast

• Withstood an assault from a robot Hulk infused with the Power Cosmic

• Withstood a blast from the Watcher

• Survived a blast from the Infinity Gauntlet, and being smacked by it

• Took a hit from Galactus

• Shields are stated to be stronger than Susan Storm’s 

• Susan’s own shields were able to stand up to the universe destroying Incursion and defend against stray shots from Doom’s own Big Bang Cannons, which were said to be “weaponized building blocks of the universe”

• Susan’s shields were also able to block attacks from Celestials

• His own force field can temporarily endure Celestial beams

• Survived an attack from the Beyonder that knocked out Galactus

• Even without his force fields, a headbutt from Hulk merely dents his armor

• Repeatedly has survived beatings from Hulk and Sentry

• Can take a hit from Ares who has matched Thor and Hercules in power, even bloodying his half-brother to a significant extent

Weaknesses

Lex

Lex is one of the smartest villains in DC Comics, but that intelligence doesn’t lead him to success very often. Lex’s greed and arrogance often leads him into bad decision making that costs him far more.The infamous Zone Child incident comes to mind, where he had literally infinite power, but was not allowed to use it to hurt others. However, he still tried to use that power to kill Superman, and thus, he lost it. Lex will often try to take the fastest route possible, without realizing why that route is such a problem. And much like his opponent in this fight, anytime his nemesis (Superman) is involved, expect Lex to try and focus the entirety of his resources and plan into killing him or getting revenge on him.

Also, he won’t wash his hands… because he's evil.  

Doom

For all of Doom’s might, he is not completely invincible. His most obvious flaw is his boundless ego. He may have reason to think highly of himself, but his unmatched arrogance has landed him in failure when it mattered most. And we don’t just mean that he underestimates his opponents either. His ego itself has led to him overlooking major issues with his own plans or important parts of a battlefield. If Reed Richards is involved, expect Doom to focus the ENTIRETY of his power on trying to kill or get revenge on Reed as painfully as possible, often putting himself into a trap. He himself is well aware of this flaw. Doom also has several minor things that you wouldn’t expect are a problem for him, but somehow are. These include (but are not limited to):

• Hulk Hugs™

• Cupcakes

• Squirrels 

• Entering normally

• Sandwich crusts  

• Crazy black men (He is actually the CEO of Racism)

Summary

Lex Luthor

“I can't think of a morning I haven't woken up with the thought of strangling you. That sanctimonious image of yours fooled everyone except me. Because I know evil.”

Advantages:

• Slightly stronger 

• Slightly faster

• Motherbox grants him a variety of hax

• Comparable intellect

• Potentially better hacking

• Phasing could help him to bypass Doom’s forcefield

• 40 cakes

• Jolly Ranchers

• The Lex Express

Disadvantages:

• Physically weaker when Doom is amped by magic

• Less defensive and longevity options than Doom

• Limited to a battle of technology; does not have an equivalent to Doom’s mystical arts

• Power absorption and nullification could leave him helpless

• Telepathy could be quite problematic when used on Doom’s level

• Doesn’t have a counter to soul manipulation

• Has no counter to the Prime Mover

• Has no counter to narrative freezing

• Less experienced

• Doom is a Karen

• Uncircumcised

Doctor Doom

“You dare to impugn my honesty? I, the Lord of Latveria? The mightiest of monarchs?”

Advantages:

• Physically stronger when amped by magic

• Shields, healing, and time travel grant incredible defense and longevity

• Far more versatile, and magic is an avenue that Lex cannot explore

• Magic has more raw power than any of Lex’s tools

• Armor is more durable

• Immortal

• Superior power absorption and nullification

• Ovoid Mind Transfer

• Lex has no counter to the Prime Mover

• Lex has no counter to narrative freezing

• More experienced

• Comparable intellect

• Resists hacking

• Toots as he pleases

• F O O T D I V E

Disadvantages:

• Slightly physically weaker more consistently

• Slightly slower

• Though far from unskilled or inexperienced, does not as often resort to fisticuffs

• Lex could potentially phase past his defenses and land a killing blow

• Latveria’s bakery is probably gonna be robbed

Verdicts

Team Lex 

Malcolm Belmont

flames of the faltine

Soo, this is my first verdict of the season. I decided not to give my thoughts and opinions on Yoda vs Mickey and Shadow vs Ryuko due to me feeling that the other verdicts pretty much summed up everything i wanted to say but for this DEATH BATTLE in particular i wanted to give my thoughts. I will admit that this reveal got spoiled to me by my own fears and worries about how Shadow vs Ryuko would end. I was slightly annoyed at myself at the time which may have coloured my thoughts on Lex vs Doom (which were neutral to kinda negative) but the more i thought about the fight, the more it made sense even though i still would have preferred Gil vs Doom. Anyway onto the fight itself. 

I think if you look at it as raw stats - Lex honestly probably has it. The reason why I think Lex wins is a combination of two things - his massive speed advantage and his hax. 

It should be noted that the two are rather comparable when it comes to strength and durability with both Lex and Doom having hurt Universe Busters such as Lex hurting the likes of Wonder Woman, Superman, and people who have the power of Shazam. While Doom has hurt beings such as Mephisto,Thor and the Hulk. Both have also tanked attacks from those beings so the gap between Lex and Doom for Strength and Durability is fairly equal. But Lex has a massive advantage over Doom in terms of speed. 

Lex is capable of keeping up with Superman in their fights, Superman is capable to fly from Vega to Earth in a short amount of time a feat that is likely Faster then Light considering the distance. Superman has also fought the likes of Wonder Woman who can block the pieces of the Shattered God (52 quintillion - 315 quintillion c). Lex himself has also fought against Larfreeze who is an Orange Lantern comparable to Green Lanterns Hal and Guy who could cross the universe in about 10 hours while their rings are on standby mode (87 quadrillion c). Even if you significantly lowball Lex o Herald Level DC characters (which he should) scaling to Superman and the likes of Wonder Woman is far more impressive a speed feat then Doom being quick enough to deflect Mjolnir. Mjolner has moved speeds at 525.91 quadrillion - 1.05 quintillion c and Doom would have to be fast enough to react to that. Even if you high ball that and put Doom’s speed at 1.05 Quintillion C, Lex scaling to Wonder Woman and Green Lantern would put him much higher. 

So yeah Strength and Durability are fairly equal but Lex has a huge advantage in speed so who wins? Well i would lean towards Lex as due to his speed advantage it’s unlikely that Doom will be able to hit and react to Lex’s attacks. I know what you are thinking - what about those shields, shouldn’t that be able to protect him? Well maybe. This was a big debate in the community when it comes to this fight - Lex definitely has Speed and Strength considering DC Heralds are more impressive than Marvel Heralds but if Lex is able to land a definitive hit on Doom considering he has shields that protect him from any sort of damage? The answer in my opinion is likely yes.Lex has phasing technology that allows him to go through walls - wouldn’t be impossible for Lex to get around Doom’s pesky armour by simply phasing through it and disrupting Doom’s armour? Such things have happened in the past with Doom and while he has resistance against straight up possession - straight up phasing through Doom should definitely be possible and would allow Lex all the time in the world to quickly hack and disable Doom’s armour living him as just a man - a magical man perhaps but still a man and considering Lex’s strength and speed advantage without Doom’s shields, he would be more than capable enough to land a finishing blow and finish Doom.

Granted this is one hypothetical scenario and in a fight that is as close at this i could see either character winning. I am not going to be surprised either way who wins and i am not going to be upset either - both are fantastic villains and both more than deserve to win this fight but i am slightly but only very slightly leaning Lex if Lex can disable Doom’s armour and shields. If he couldn’t then I would say Doom wins but either way i can’t wait till I see the outcome of this fight as well as next time. 

Robin (TexasRoastingOnAnOpenFire)

(This blog was so much fun to make!)

85% of the viewer base wanted Doom to fight Gil, and so did I. Fate seems like a cool series, and Gil looks like an absolute badass and would have been a fun matchup for Doom. However, we’ve gotten Lex instead..and I’m still completely happy!

Both had fairly good episodes, but both were victims to having some bizarrely low stats at the time. Lex got downplayed hard in particular, definitely deserving a win over Tony in my opinion. Now we’ve got Doom, who’s beaten Vader, up against Lex, who lost to Tony. Casuals are definitely confused at how this is even a matchup, but I assure you that it is. Lex and Doom are a perfect matchup, and even though I’m only barely leaning one way for this verdict I honestly think both have the opportunity to win. I’ll go through their stats first and foremost.

Really, cosmology plays a big key here. Universe size decides just how powerful these two are in their base stats. Going with the most commonly accepted universe sizes of 1 trillion (Marvel) and 100 trillion (DC), Lex should take strength and speed (not durability, we’ll get to that later) to a pretty good degree. If you use some sketchy higher numbers such as the 100 trillion thought year statement for Marvel or use the 60 trillion per half second expanding Big Bang scene from DC, you can argue both universes as being massively bigger. However, in this instance it would really result in DC’s still being larger. If you argue instead that both are infinite, then...well, Doom and Lex have even stats. I’m not too sure how I feel on the size of the universes and my opinions change over time, but right now I’m feeling the normally accepted sizes. Using this, Lex and Doom should both be Uni+ to different degrees, and via scaling to the many herald Uni feats (Hyperion, Kyle) that both universes have, Lex should come out with a like, 44,000x stronger physical AP and the speed feats he scales to should be faster overall. Doom isn’t out of the running, however.

Both have pretty significant hax, with Lex capable of phasing, throwing people in bizarre 2D prisons, and having the wonderfully haxxy Motherbox at his disposal. Sadly for him, however, Doom is a master of hax. Whether it be the Mind Transfer, straight up freezing Lex’s damn narrative entirely, and time travel! That’s not even all of it, but in a hax battle Doom really cannot be topped. All he needs to do is survive a hit or two and get off some magic, such as The Flames of The Faltine (which can hurt being WAY above Lex’s paygrade) and he’d clench a win. His shields allow him to do that, as they’ve consistently allowed him to survive blows characters way above herald scaling in his universe. Seems like an easy win for Doom, eh?

Well, I don’t quite think so. Lex’s phasing should allow him to get through Doom’s shields. If he can, then Doom won’t be able to survive very long as Lex in my opinion should be physically superior to him in the Warsuit. It’s debatable whether or not phasing works, as Doom may have resisted it against Vision...but I’m still iffy on that scene entirely as it’s quite vague and Doom has had Shadowcat phase in on him before. It seems weird to give a verdict to someone based on a single ability, but I ultimately believe Lex and his stats should be able to clench him the win assuming he can get through that shield, which at the moment I think is a reasonable argument.

Da Lunge Fish

 

 What’s up. The thick lipped, buck teeth green catfish here, talking about Lex vs Doom. Yeah, yeah, yeah, Marvel vs DC, fuck Death Battle, dislike unsubscribe. On the serious note, I’m actually glad this happened over Gil vs Doom which I heard is a huge stomp. 

Anyway, the advantages are all here. Hax potency and defences for Doom, physical stats for Lex. At first, it seems like Lex is completely and utterly screwed. What will speed and strength do when he can’t even scratch Doom’s Skyfather lever forcefield? Well, a magical thing came from the sky called phasing. 

Basically, Lex had a one off device called matter transmuter (judging by the name it moves molecules to walk from things). With it, Lex could not just walk through walls but also send other people through them. Now, this seems like a major trump card Lex has. Some may wonder, why would Lex use it on Doom, it’s a one off device! Well, it’s kinda logical. A guy has an indestructible forcefield, so if a blockhead like me thought of it being a viable win con, I’m pretty sure so would a genius Lex is. That’s also not the only potential fuckery with the forcefield Lex can perform, there’s also the motherbox and hacking that at the very least matches Victor’s own. But wait. There’s one last thing. Doom resisted phasing several times, hasn’t he? Well, it’s complicated. In all of these instances he had to actively fuck with the phasing, not his forcefield doing it passively. And with Lex’s tremendous speed edge (at least sextillions c) Doom ain’t having time to do so. He also often used specifics of the phasing, like screwing with vision’s robotic body or ectoplasm. He never faced Lex’s kind of intangibility, that is affecting molecules. Now, I haven’t discussed a lot of things, like intelligence (imo both are equal), but that’s cause I think it’s really not necessary.Lex has a speed edge, and he certainly would come up with the plan to use phasing, having the intelligence and reaction time to do so. 

            Luthor will f-Lex on the competition, grabbing the Victor-y.

  P.S.  Yes, I know Doom has possession after death, but Lex resisted it from the Zone Child, so that won’t work.

Team Doom

MomoUra

(Doom was fun to play in MvC3)

Wasn’t here to make a verdict for Shadow vs Ryuko, So before I start I’d like to say that it was absolutely phenomenal. It’s definitely one of my new favorite Death Battle episodes of all time. Props to the team who worked on it. 

Now when I first saw the Doom teaser I was naturally excited the most for his fight. After all, Doom is probably one of my favorite Marvel villains of all time (and after looking into his stuff for the upcoming episode, he IS my new favorite Marvel villain). I was hoping it was Gilgamesh leading up to Season 8’s start but, I also started to slowly grow fond of Lex vs Doom. When we finally got to the reveal of it, a lot of people were disappointed. But I felt the exact opposite, I was warmed up and excited to see what they do with it. After talking about the match up with friends and debating and discussing the different layers of it, I’m very glad it happened instead of Gilgamesh. This match ups is just really fun and I wasn’t expecting myself to be this hyped for it honestly. This is one of the more interesting Marvel vs DC fights they could’ve done, and part of that is due to the debate, which I’ll be discussing my thoughts on. 

Doctor Doom Stats: 

Doom has pretty reliable scaling to herald tiers in Marvel. For starters, he consistently fights on par with the Fantastic Four, being their arch nemesis and all. Fighting on par with the Thing is impressive enough, considering he’s comparable to Grey Hulk who can shatter an asteroid twice the size of earth (86.9 yottatons). Thing has also fought Savage Hulk a few times so it’s possible he can get some herald scaling too, although that is slightly less reliable than the Large Planet tier that all middle diddlers should get. 

Beyond that however, he gets even higher scaling. He’s fought and damaged Savage Hulk before, the guy who consistently fights Thor across many, many comic issues. Doom himself has fought on par with Thor once, and even tanked his hits. Pretty impressive considering Thor can travel the in mere seconds, which gets around 5 - 10 quintillion times the speed of light. 

He also scales to Silver Surfer, who can casually travel between light years. 

Scaling to Hulk also gives Doom scaling to Hyperion, who tanked the incursion of two universes. Accounting for the amount of light years in the Marvel Universe would get this to around Multiversal (218,000). This is also due to the amount of realms in 616. 

Doom has also tanked hits from the likes of Thanos and Galactus, who are even higher than Thor. Specifically, his force fields and shields are extremely durable and will be some of Doom’s best abilities to use in this match. Not only are they stated to be superior to Susan Storm’s as seen here, but they’ve also tanked hits from the likes of Cyclops’ optic blasts  and Celestial beams. Hell, Sue’s own force fields can cut through Celestial armor and tank hits from Galactus, and while it was a later version of Sue, Doom has since then consistently kept pace with her and the Fantastic Four, So its not unreasonable to say he couldn’t have Gotten stronger as well. Lastly there’s an argument for Doom’s durability scaling to Beyonder of all people, since in Secret Wars, Doom followed Galactus into a rip hole where Beyonder blasted a beam from. 

As for higher end arguments? Well 

The marvel universe is very likely to be infinite in size. Check the doc here. I know there’s a counter in the fact that the universe is said to have an edge, but many things in Marvel and DC defy physics like...Wally outrunning the goddamn speed force lmao. So basically it should be fine for marvel with how consistent they are and how reliable the sources are. Destroying the universe would then make the feat Multi+, which Doom would scale to.

Same goes for speed feats. Thor traveling from earth to Asgard would be infinite speeds, especially with the place of Asgard in Marvel Cosmology. Traveling through the 10 realms would also allow for this tiering. But the thing is, Doom might not even need infinite universe diameter to get Multi+

He fought on par with Mephisto, before Mephisto made an illusion for him, and after that, still wrestled with him despite the illusion being Mephisto himself. This was all in his realm btw, which would also make Doom around Multi+ based off Mephisto being comparable to folks like Odin and Zarathos. 

This ties back to Doom’s durability being Multi+ too. Celestials and Galactus are also in that range and Doom can tank attacks from them. 

Now to move onto Lex

Lex Luthor Stats:

Gotta say, I’m really surprised people were doubting herald Lex as if it isn’t a thing. I can assure you now, it definitely is. While I myself doubted Lex scaling fully to Supes, given Clark tries his best to not kill humans, and kryptonite furthers the gap for his strength being lower, that doesn’t mean Lex shouldn’t scale at all. There have been times where Supes can take care of Lex with ease and times Lex can pummel and ragdoll Supes. Lex is consistently inferior but he’s definitely in some sort of similar league to Clark.

Besides constantly trading blows with Superman, Lex has some other scaling opportunities to heralds. He’s blasted Wonder Woman and Flash, reacted to a blitz attempt from Larfleeze, tanked multiple hits from him with minimal damage, stabbed and pummeled Supergirl (who doesn’t nearly hold back as much as Clark), and has fought Flash and Starfire. Overall still pretty consistently herald tier.

What feats does he get from this? Well for one he’d be comparable to Green Lanterns, like Kyle Rayber, who can block the Big Bang. Captain Atom destroyed the main universe 3 times, and also re created them. Wonder Woman’s lasso can recreate and destroy entire timelines. The clash between the two Supermans was threatening to destroy the universe, etc. Lex should be around 9 million times universal. 

As for speed feats? Well Captain Atom destroying the universe in the first place, gets around sextillions c at bare minimum. If you take the nanosecond part of it literally, it gets nonillions c. Hal crossing the universe in Pre Crisis gets low quintillion’s c, and Hal and Guy’s travel got quadrillions c. There’s also the infamous shattered god feat which got around low to high quintillions c. So overall pretty good speed stats to combat with Doom, in fact he’s likely a lot faster. 

And just like with Doom, his higher end arguments consist of using The statements for DC’s universe being infinite in size, and using the universal or traveling across the universe feats to give Lex Multi+ and Infinite speeds.

Now to move into abilities:

Doctor Doom Abilities: 

Doom has many useful abilities and gadgets. From electric blasts and busts he can Shoot from his hands, from summoning elemental attacks, and several stunning gasses. His suit has built in time circuitry which let’s him freeze, or even travel through time. Definitely something Luthor has no counter to.

Doom of course also has his many array of Doombots at his disposal. These could possibly trick Lex into thinking he killed Doom when he actually didn’t, though to Lex’s credit he is pretty smart. So he likely wouldn’t fall for the trick more than once, if at all. Now to move onto the abilities that straight up cuck Lex out of a win though.

First is power absorption. Doom can completely drain you of your power, and at the same time turn you old, unable to fight anymore. This is a really busted ability that when Doom lands on Lex, is practically a game over.

Second is the prime mover. This is essentially a doom bot that can control reality and others fates. It can rewrite lives and history and if it’s used against Lex, he’s basically just fucked. I’ve seen some arguments for it being non standard but I don’t quite believe in them so I think it should be fine.

Third is transmutation and matter manipulation. Doom can transform solids into pure energy and rearrange matter. This is an ability that Lex has no counter to, so if Doom really wanted to, he could just absorb Lex once he turns him into energy.

Fourth is narrative freezing, an ability where Doom freezes someone down to a narrative level. He’s basically freezing your story, and it works on a conceptual level.

Finally is the ovoid mind transfer. This allows Doom to swap souls with another person and essentially take over their mind and body. It’s very powerful and he can spam it even as a spirit too. This means that even if Lex kills Doom, he has the opportunity to take over Lex afterwards. The zone child example also doesn’t help Lex resist it since that’s more so mind and willpower as opposed to body possession and soul swapping.

Lex Luthor Abilities:

Lex has a sort of attack reflection/absorption ability. Basically anything with KE that gets sent to his suit, he can absorb and re-direct 10x more powerful. While it will certainly help against Doom’s projectiles, it won’t help his soul being taken over or his power getting drained.

Lex also has motherbox technology and hacking. He was able to hack Brainiac (albeit with some prep time) and with the motherbox he can portal in and out through dimensions.

Finally he has a matter transmuter, aka phasing. This had made us crazy for a while because it seemed like it would work on Doom. That is until this scan was found. It basically let’s doom resist intangibility and phasing. 

Conclusion:

So in the end who should take this bout?

Well I do think it’s debatable. When you look at finite feats Lex stat stomps. Plain and simple, he’s more than 40x stronger and he’s millions of times faster at minimum. But that’s also forgetting Doom’s multi+ scaling via fighting mephisto. This doesn’t even require infinite universe diameter, just mephisto’s own feats of destroying infinite planes of reality across the multiverse. As for speed, Thor traveling across Asgard from earth or Supes accidentally flying through time, both can be taken as infinite or immeasurable speed feats for the two.  So atm I have them around even in speed with Lex much stronger without mephisto scaling and much weaker with mephisto scaling

But what if we do exclude mephisto from this?

That’s when Doom’s trump cards come into play. His force fields are just way too tough for Lex to scratch through. Beings like Celestials are much much stronger then Lex, and the same applies for Galactus. Besides his force fields his armor alone can tank attacks from the likes of the Infinity Gauntlet and Beyonder. Doom has many many ways to kill Lex as mentioned above. He can rewrite Lex’s reality, stop time and transmute Lex into energy, travel back in time and leave Lex stranded (BFR). Or just freeze his story on a conceptual level altogether. And to top it all off, Doom could always just take over Lex’s soul in the end if he ever does end up dying. I side with Doctor Doom in this fight. I wouldn’t be surprised if Lex ended up winning, but I will be rooting and betting on Doom.

Birb

(Beyonder out here w Titanium Toenail pauldrons.)

First Marvel vs DC of the year boys. And we’re starting off with a fucking banger, we are. 

Lex Luthor vs Doctor FUCKING Doom.

I think it’s fair to say both of these guys got kinda downplayed during their original bouts. Doom slightly less, cause he beat Vader, but both have insane capabilities that neither Doom vs Vader or Tony vs Lex really touched on. This is an opportunity for both to really show exactly what we’re dealing with when bringing them into a vs scenario, and boy, both are capable of some crazy shit.

Starting off with ap, both are easily, easily, universal, and prolly higher. Lex has tussled with Lanterns, including fucking Larfleeze, the dude who’s an entire corps in one. He’s smacked around the likes of Flash, Wonder Woman and Starfire in his Warsuit. The thing lets him take on Kryptonians with its Kryptonite weaponry. Doom meanwhile isn’t lacking behind either. He’s tanked hits from Galactus, Celestials, Hulk, Sue Storm and Thor, and has been consistently able to fight back. Name someone in Marvel, he’s likely fucked their shit up at least once.

Speedwise, both are in the quintillions range due to fighting on par with Thor and Larfleeze respectively. You could argue, however, that Lex is a bit faster, but it’s not enough to concretely say he’d have an advantage.

So who wins? 

Should be obvious, due to where this verdict is placed, but I’m repping Doom here. Speed’s about equal, and could go either way, but the thing is, Lex’s advantages only get him as far as it does in a battle of technology. The absolute moment Doom busts out the magic, most of Lex’s options are either countered, lose effectiveness or just simply don’t work. Yes, Lex has tanked hits from Larfleeze and was able to hack Braniac’s tech but both of these examples aren’t as impressive as they seem. Larfleeze didn’t have his power battery at the time and Lex spent months studying Braniac’s tech prior. Meanwhile, Doom’s shields allow him to walk off hits from Galactus, Celestials, the Power Stone, and The Beyonder. And if you think Doom’s just a stone wall, nope. He’s one of the most absurd magic users in Marvel continuity. Scarlet Witch claimed that Doom’s magic eclipses both Doctor Strange and her own. Doctor Strange admitted Doom knows shit he doesn’t. Thanos has tabs on the guy cause he’s scared shitless of what Doom is capable of. This is the man who built a robot capable of playing around with people’s fates like literal chess pieces. This is the man who narratively froze Loki. Doom’s own existence goes beyond the physical and he exists himself as a story, a living narrative. This man was able to trap someone who was amped by the Phoenix Force in a time loop. This man strolled up to Mephisto in his own realm without his suit, and proceeded to beat the demonic shit out of him with his bare fucking hands. Lex is powerful, yes, but he’s not standing up to this. 

Let’s compare wincons, shall we? Lex can possibly phase past Doom’s shields and attack him directly, but the speed difference isn’t great enough for him to feasibly do that, and it might not even work. Doom? Unbound by time he could just go back to when Lex is vulnerable and end him there. The Motherbox Doom can just absorb it’s power like he can with the Power Cosmic or The Beyonder’s power. Doom has viruses that can directly shut down Lex’s suit and go to town on him, while if Lex shuts down Doom’s suit, he still has to deal with Doom’s insane magic capabilities. Bring in Apex Lex and God Emperor Doom is fair game as well, and God Emperor Doom is in Marvel’s top 15 most powerful characters. Even if Lex somehow kills Doom, he’ll still be susceptible to the Ovoid Mind Transfer. Doom can distract Lex with Doombots, either using the Inhibitor Ray to stop Lex in his tracks, or sitting back and letting the Prime Mover fuck Lex over. 

Let me put it this way. Lex needs a special suit abusing the weaknesses of kryptonians to compete with them. Doom’s magic, which his suit allows him to abuse on the fly, cannot be turned off and those who are masters of both technology and magic are afraid of him.

I went into this debate cautiously aware of Doom’s reputation for being wanked, but it’s not wank. If anything it’s downplay. Doom dominates this matchup without question. He simply has far too many options for Lex to account for, whereas Lex has one option for victory that might not even work. I say the victor of this fight is Victor Von Doom. I expect nothing lex from the Monarch of Latveria, while Lex shall surely face his doom as his options become incorporeal.

Random Guy #7

(First time on G1 was a blast!)

Alrighty, Ryuko vs Shadow was a solid 7/10 for me, still a good start to a season. What’s next?

*sees Lex vs Doom*

Ah jeez. I can smell the Fate fans coming.

All joking aside, while I was originally a pretty large detester of the matchup (I thought Doom had better options and Lex didn’t need to come back.), after having the faulty dynamics of Gil vs Doom revealed to me and realizing one good episode can be followed up with another, I’m all for this matchup. 

But is the debate any good?

OH YEAH. BIG TIME.

As a guy, who like most went into this wholeheartedly expecting Doom to omega stomp Lex, I was very surprised at how well the debate turned out. Between Lex having New God tech and phasing to possibly keep up with Doom, this debate made for a surprisingly good time.

But let’s just break it down for ya category by category. Starting off in the almighty stat Trinity, it depends on whether or not you are a believer of finite or infinite diameter for both Marvel and DC. If you only buy finite, Lex has the edge in AP and Speed, while Doom’s barrier dwarfs him in the Durability department.

However if you buy infinite diameter (which I do personally), they should be almost equal AP wise, and Lex should still be faster, but not nearly to quite the extent beforehand. The one thing that remains consistent between both however is Doom’s shield being higher in Dura.

So how does Lex get past a walking safety field that would block almost any attack he sends at it? Well there could be a possible answer in Lex phasing. In an Old Silver Age comic it was discovered Lex had a device known as a Matter Transmutator that allowed him to cause himself and others to phase through matter.

This would be a possible solution to Lex’s problem, as it would allow him to bypass Doom’s shield and possibly score a game winning shot. However from what I’ve seen I don’t believe that to be the case.

Now while it would be easy to just say Doom blocked Vision and Nightmare to silence that argument, you could just as easily argue that Doom had specific knowledge on the dynamics of how their intangibility worked, and planned accordingly to block it. Neither being the way Lex’s phasing works.

However, I do believe Doom has a different way of countering Lex’s phasing. Doom has shown the ability in the past to turn intangible beings tangible, not through his forcefield, but rather another one of his powers he has on hand at his disposal.

He also has many tricks up his sleeve to screw with Lex, including Narrative Freezing, Superior Magical prowess, a couple forms of soul haxing, and depending on whether or not they decide to give Doom access to his ENTIRE doombot army across the years, even possible Fate Manipulation. 

It’s even an entire possibility for Lex to kill Doom, and Doom to just use his Dimensional Travel to crawl right on up from hell and start fighting Lex again just like that!

It’s a surprisingly interesting debate and the two have an insane amount of crazy tech at their disposals, but in the end I believe Dr. Doom is going to take this one.

Wolf

This one is exciting to me. These two are some of my favorite villains in comic books. Lex and Doom both have some incredibly awesome moments, and they feel like perfect opponents for each other. As for who wins, that was...an incredibly tricky question to answer. Despite the fact that Lex normally fights with Superman, he’s never really properly beaten Superman in a fight. He’s come close, sure, but Doom’s held his own against opponents I’d argue are on equal weight with Superman, if not stronger than him, like Silver Surfer and Thanos. Then there’s the fact that Doom’s armor is very easily stronger than the Warsuit thanks to the fact that it’s pretty much fused to his skin. Hell Doom only needs to get Lex out of his warsuit to win. So this is an easy win for Doom? Eeeeh not really

First off, Doom’s skill mostly relies on his hax, but Lex is still stronger and faster than Doom is. He also has his own hax that can not only protect him from some of Doom’s hax, but can also make things frustrating for Doom, including the healing factor his suit has and the fact that it’s possibly more durable than what Doom has since it’s made with a Motherbox, something Darkseid doesn’t screw around with. Lex and Doom both prefer defensive fighting from what I’ve seen, waiting for their opponents to make a move that will leave an opening for them (unless it’s their nemeses, in which case they go into attack mode and never stop)

So how does Lex lose this? Simple: Doom’s armor protects him from too many things Lex can offer, and most of Lex’s tricks and hax won’t really affect Doom. Lex can’t really drain Doom of energy from his armor since Doom typically doesn’t use energy for his weapons and tools. Plus, Lex doesn’t really have an answer for magic, which is something Doom uses plenty of. Sure, his suit can protect him with the force field, but that will only last so long when Doom powers himself up. I will admit, this match was a lot closer than I originally believed. Lex had some abilities we discovered were able to close the gap enough to make it an interesting and even kind of debatable fight. But Doom’s better stats, hax, armor, and experience I think will give him the edge. Poor Lex will be meeting with his Doom while the doctor will be the Victor. My vote goes to Victor von Doom

AkhilPDX

You know, I’m just patiently waiting for something with comics. “What’ll be the first episode with Marvel or DC,” I kept thinking to myself. Ant-Man VS Atom? Scarlet Witch VS Zatanna? Plastic Man VS Mr. Fantastic? The possibilities were endless, or maybe, maybe it is Doom’s fight. He’s obviously gonna fight Gilgamesh, right? Or maybe Black Adam. Lex is a possibility, sure, but are they really gonna use him? He’s a returning combatant and thered’s very little reason to bring him back when his first episode was so g-

Mfw.

I’m not gonna lie. This fight has definitely grown on me since it was originally revealed. When I saw that it would be the next episode, I wasn’t too surprised nor did I have any specific feelings towards the fight. It was just neutral. Not that I wasn’t excited to work on the blog, but it was just this neutral feeling of, Lex is returning. Awesome! He’s fighting Doom… eh. I get the theme. I get why it was done, but at first, it was just this feeling of “Lex is gonna die harder than he did against Tony” and not much more to it. Now though, it’s so much more. This fight is cool. It’s thematic, has a lot of potential, and can be done really good. But now, since that’s out of the way, time to get to what you’ve all been waiting for: who wins?

Well, you’ve probably noticed that giant “Team Doom” header GB put above so you do know who I’m arguing for. I think Doom wins in a pretty clearcut fight. It’s definitely closer than I originally thought. I can 100% say that but in the end, I do still think Doom wins relatively easily. First, let’s get stats out of the way.

Who’s stronger? I’d have to say Lex is likely stronger. Doom isn’t necessarily one of those characters who would engage someone in a physical brawl and there’s not too many feats of him doing that. He has fought Iron Man in his Extremis suit before so that should place him at some degree of herald tier but Lex should have a slight advantage. He regularly goes toe to toe with characters like Superman and Supergirl. Granted, he does require kryptonite but it’s not just kryptonians that he’s fought. He’s taken on other heavy hitters in DC such as Larfleeze and he’s even strong enough to snap Brainiac’s neck. Now, that being said, I don’t support Lex being put as high as some might want to place him. Circling back around to that kryptonite argument, he’s reliant on that aplenty and when he fights some of the higher herald tier characters, there are very few instances where he actually wins against these stronger characters. We’ll get back to that later though. 

Speed is a bit more difficult to precisely pin down. Lex is definitely quick, keeping pace with some of DC’s faster characters. That being said though, Doom keeps up with some of Marvel’s faster characters, such as Thor and Silver Surfer and he’s not reliant on any weapons that may exploit their weaknesses. We can argue about how fast these characters are all day, but if we look at what’s reasonably consistent, they should both at a low end be capable of keeping up with characters that are quadrillions - quintillions of times the speed of light. In Lex’s case, even weaker Green Lanterns can cross the universe in about 10 hours which gets about 87 quadrillion c when factoring in DC’s universe diameter of about 100 trillion lightyears (double if you use 200 trillion as diameter). This is a lower end feat as Lanterns have been shown the ability to cross the universe in shorter amounts of time when pushed to the brink, even flying from the edge of the DC universe to Earth in about 3 - 5 minutes, easily reaching speeds up to 17 quintillion times the speed of light as a mid-end and about 10.5 quintillion c as a low-end. Doom on the other hand can fight on par with Thor and even react to Mjolnir. Mjolnir has traversed all 10 of the main realms within an extremely short timeframe. Even if we assume it took about a minute, it would reach approximately 10.5 quintillion c using Marvel’s extended diameter for the universe of 1 trillion lightyears (2 trillion for diameter). If we use a timeframe of about 30 seconds, which is far more accurate while still being a lower-end timeframe, it gets almost 21.1 quintillion times c. Ofc, there’s much greater scaling for both, even in finite terms, reaching up to septillions, octillions, and nonillions c but more importantly, all the math I just used is really not that important in the long run because both universes are infinite! I’m gonna plagiarize my own work for a second.

“The Marvel Universe is a vast phenomenon. At a very minimum, it’s at least 2 trillion lightyears in diameter (assuming the Earth is in the middle of the universe). Depending on what “thought years” are, the universe could be far greater than just 2 trillion lightyears, even via finite statements for thought is repeatedly stated to be far faster than light. However, the universe is far more likely to be greater than a simple finite value due to the consistent statements of the universe being truly infinite. You could say that some statements might be hyperbolic or symbolic, but there are far more reliable statements from reliable sources such as Odin Borson, the Watcher, and Galactus that debunk this notion. The Living Tribunal states the universe is infinite. The Beyonder describes the 616 universe as a multiverse, being composed of an endless number of dimensions and myriad planes of reality. A single universe creates an infinite number of alternate realities / timelines every quantum moment over and over, AD Infinitum.

More statements: 

1. Infinite Space

2. End of Infinity

3. Odin & Stark (Full Scan)

4. Infinite Universe (Silver Surfer Black)

5. Winds of Infinity (Silver Surfer Black)

6. Infinite Canyons of 10 Realm (Thor 2020 #13)”

And…

Just like with Marvel, DC has numerous statements alluding to an infinite sized universe. Yeah I really haven’t looked into DC as much but trust me, it has a lot more.

Citation: Infinite sized Marvel & DC Universes (By Akhil)

This would mean that any universal feat would technically be universal+ and theoretically a lot higher by normal standards and by volume scaling standards, the latter of which would make them multiversal+. It would also make all the speed feats I just listed infinite speed feats, but of course, not everything is that simple. There are degrees to infinity, especially in Marvel. If Green Lanterns traveled an infinite distance, Mjolnir would have traveled across 10 sets of infinite realities in a shorter timeframe and even beyond that, you have characters like Valkyrie literally scouring across all 10 realms and every point inbetween (let’s pretend it’s not Superflow space) in the span of an eyeblink which is approximately a single decisecond. Even by a finite calc (credit to Tommy), it gets almost 3 undecillion times the speed of light, but really, it’s not even infinite but rather, an immeasurable speed feat. How can you even potentially begin to grasp the complexity of the distances she traveled? Essentially, what I’m trying to say is that on a low-end, Lex is slightly faster and he might keep that advantage into the mid-end feats but eventually, it peaks out and becomes even, if not becoming an advantage for Doom. 

Moving on from speed, we get to durability. This is that one category where one character jumps blatantly ahead and that’s Doctor Doom. I see no way Lex can have the durability advantage in any way, shape, or form. When it comes to shields, Doom does significantly better on a much more consistent basis. Sure, he has an anti-feat here and there, but yeah, he’s consistently much better. His shields are comparable to those of Susan Storm who could temporarily protect against an incursion, which, just for reference, annihilated everything within both the 616 universe and the Ultimate universe. The 616 universe has been verbatim stated to be infinitely big and multiversal+ in size by the Beyonder himself. She could also block blasts from Celestials and Galactus which would bare minimum put them at multiversal+, building consistency to her power. I mean, her shields can literally protect you from excess Ultimate Nullifier energy that would wipe out an entire universe without problem. Doom’s own shields can protect him from attacks from Celestials and even a hit from Thanos with the Infinity Gauntlet. Now, yes, he was using the Power Gem only, but even then, that’s significantly above Lex’s paygrade. If you don’t believe that, well then, look at the time Doom’s shields took a blast from the Beyonder that knocked out Galactus. The BEYONDER. Sure, Galactus took most of the blast, but a single electron of Beyonder’s emanated physical form contains more power than an entire galaxy so don’t hold it against Doom. Even without the shields, he can take hits from Thor, Sentry, and Galactus so his armor is pretty damn powerful. Lex on the other hand has taken hits from Superman and Supergirl. His shields are powerful enough to block an attack from Larfleeze. The Warsuit was even able to take an omnidirectional energy blast from Larfleeze and only had a minor dent in it. That being said, as powerful as Larfleeze is, he’s not exactly on par with Celestials or Thanos channeling the power of the Infinity Stones, let alone even a fraction of the power the Beyonder has, especially when you take into account the fact that he didn’t have his Power Battery, making him much weaker. Now yes, I could go into how overpowered Larfleeze is, even without his Orange Battery, but no, I’m not going to scale Lex to Parallax, especially once you see what’s coming. And no, I’m not saying Doom is as powerful as Celestials or the Beyonder. He eventually lost to the Celestials but it took at least 2 of them and he held them off of a good bit. With how Celestials are above skyfather level entities like Mephisto, it’s pretty impressive.

Now, finally, we go onto the other categories, but I’d like to format that a bit differently this time around, in the form of going through it like a Q&A, involving the questions I’ve been asked the most or the questions I’ve seen asked the most.

1. How strong is Lex Luthor in comparison to other DC Heralds?

   

This is definitely a good question that’s asked because he’s not equal to someone like Superman. He really, really, really isn’t. Scaling does not make you equal to someone. It never has and it never will. It at best puts you comparable to them, and yes, I understand how Lex could scale to a suppressed Superman but really, Superman while holding back has beaten him relatively easily when he actually started to put in the effort, so again, I don’t see how that scaling could be valid. Let’s take a look at some examples.

    A: Lex VS Superman (Justice League of America (2006) #14 - 15)

• Lex weakens Superman with kryptonite first before nearly killing him but Firestorm stops him from doing so. Then a battle ensues, where Vixen comes in and restores Superman’s powers through a kiss, putting him back to close strength or at least close enough. Hal and John bind Lex even stating that he can’t get out if they don’t want him to. As they hold him and crush his gauntlets, Superman breaks his suit with one punch.

B: Lex is knocked out by an attack that doesn’t even leave a scratch on Superman.

C: Lex VS Supergirl (Supergirl (2005) #3 - 4)

• This is an example where people try to scale Lex to Supergirl because he wasn’t using kryptonite. I have no idea how they got to that conclusion, unless ofc, they didn’t read the comic. He did use kryptonite and he used it a lot. In issue 3, we see him holding a kryptonite gauntlet. The first thing he does when he reveals himself to Kara is blast her with green kryptonite. She’s still under the effect of kryptonite when she hits him and then he blasts her with what’s presumably red kryptonite. We see Lex having green kryptonite in the panel before he beats her near to death, and then, when she’s down, he blasts her with a black kryptonite energy attack, splitting her into good Kara and bad Kara.

• In the next comic, Dark Kara literally says he’d be dead two seconds after his first attack if she really wanted him to be. So what does Lex do? He hits her with more kryptonite! God damn, with the amount of kryptonite he has, I’m not surprised he got cancer. The thing is though… Dark Kara’s not like Good Kara. She’s a bit more, out of blood. She straight up blitzes him and then breaks his kryptonite glove… sort of. He gets up and stabs her with a sword thing that’s powered by more kryptonite. Of course though, she just pushes him back and lol nopes him so badly that Lex literally flies away but she catches up to him anyways, chucking him into a moon. Lex then pleads with John Stewart to save him while Kara just flies in and calls Lex her toy, implying she was playing with him.

D: Superman VS Apex Lex (Justice League (2018) #38)

• Lex literally says he’s been wondering how it would feel to be hit by a Superman that wasn’t holding back implying that all this time, he was holding back, even the time Lex got one-shotted. Yikes. This Superman was amped by the Totality but don’t worry about that. Apex Lex is on a whole nother level of busted.

E: Lex Luthor VS Aquaman (Aquaman: Deep Dives #9)

• Lex’s weapons don’t hurt Aquaman even one bit and Mera swims around them with no problem, easily taking out his forces. Aquaman directly confronts Lex, stating that if he thinks he has a right to the deep because he paid money for it, that he should take a breath, breaking his helmet by casually crushing it, and therefore, bypassing his forcefields quite.

F: Lex Luthor VS Doomsday (Action Comics (2016) #958)

• The best Lex does is stagger Doomsday. He says on the next page that all of his weapons are useless. His suit holds up for a couple seconds before getting utterly ripped apart to the point that Lex needed to use his Motherbox to recreate it.

Is there a point to this? Yes. The point is that I disagree with Lex scaling as high as some people like to say he scales. Is he still herald? Definitely. He should be at least uni+. Does he have a physical advantage in strength against Doom? Probably, but it’s not as big as you think, and I’m gonna be frank, I don’t think Doom is as impressive when it comes to purely physical strength. That being said, for those of you who’re gonna use this to say “Lex is stronger than Thor” or “Lex is stronger than Blue Marvel”... he really isn’t. The moment Lex actually does somewhat well against Superman or Wonder Woman and continues to do that well consistently, then sure, that’s up for debate.

Now, why did I bring up Thor or Blue Marvel? Is it because Doom scales to them? Well, it’s the whole spectrum of answers. Yes, possibly, and no! In his own natural strength, he doesn’t scale and he might not in his armor but when his strength is amped by magic or some other source via his armor, then absolutely! 

His strength was compared to Blue Marvel, a guy that can tangle with the Sentry and literally one-shot Ultimate Hulk. Doom has even hurt Mephisto in literally a hoodie and his armor, albeit he was likely amped by magic. Even then, that’s insanely impressive as Mephisto’s extremely resistant to physical attack and in order to hurt him, there would need to be something metaphysical about the attack. If his magic is enough to make him comparable to someone like Thor and Mephisto, he’s definitely taking that strength advantage away from Lex quicker than Lex stole those 40 cakes.

2. How strong is Doom’s hax?

Very strong. Just, incredibly potent. Doom’s hax is one of the most dangerous out of all heralds and skyfathers in Marvel. The only characters I see competing with him in terms of hax would be someone like Silver Surfer or Odin and that really says so much about how insanely busted his power is.

His magical prowess according to Scarlet Witch is more powerful than her and Doctor Strange’s, and you might say, “Akhil, why would Doom scale to the power of Chaos Magic?” Well, he doesn’t need to. Even without Chaos Magic and purely based on her own magical skill, Wanda had ⅓ of the power required to match an entity known as Chaos (with the other ⅔ being her mother and Agatha Harkness). Chaos was described as being comparable to Eternity, the conceptual personification of the multiverse and Nightmare, owner of the Collective Unconscious.  

Speaking of Nightmare, Doom set up an actuality shield around Latveria that literally turned unreality into reality and kept out both Nightmare and Ghost Rider. Afterwards, Doom literally uses a spell to turn off the Penance Stare. He knows a spell that can turn off an attack so potent that it annihilates your soul and drops it in Oblivion. Maybe a quick reversal spell on that and Lex’s soul goes poof. He can use the Images of Ikkon and the Crimson Bands of Cyttorak. Hell, even his Doombots can use the Crimson Bands which can restrain Doctor Strange himself.

He’s powerful enough to use a Spirit Reversal Spell that can harm Sentry and just by the nature of it alone, it is something that can negate durability and something Lex hasn’t resisted. Doom has also channeled the power of Order to match the power of Scarlet Witch’s Chaos. He’s beaten Loki in a magical duel and literally trapped his story in a timeless time with a spaceless space, or a spaceless time with timeless space. Concepts in Marvel, which are layered and to a degree, gods are acausal, but more importantly, he stopped Loki’s metanarrative and froze it in a plotless plot. Take that as you will. Oh, and of course, he has the Ovoid Mind Transfer.

3. How strong is Lex’s hax?

Lex hasn’t really shown too much hax per-se. He’s shown phasing in the Pre-Crisis era, has energy blasts, and most importantly, the Motherbox. Now, this is where things get a bit complicated as Motherboxes have a lot of good abilities, but Lex has only shown so much, that being regeneration and boomtubes (and something I feel like I’m forgetting). Boomtubes are extremely helpful in that they change your shape and size if required and can allow you to teleport anywhere within the universe or even beyond it if required. He can also hack into Brainiac so that’s cool.

4. Who has the better hax?

Yeah, it should probably be obvious by now. It’s Doom. Doom 100%. The problem here though is that we have to look into whether Lex’s hax can actually work on Doom. Boomtubes are definitely something that could be problematic. It’s not really the BFR but rather how complex they are. They can literally be used to enter other planes of reality such as the Sphere of the Gods when required. 

Doom has entered Gutterspace before which is a metafictional plane of reality that transcends the multiverse and views the events of the comic panels as merely a story. From here, Gwenpool can manipulate and change the plot in whatever way she likes (with some restrictions ofc). Doom has entered Gutterspace, stating that he’s in control there as he would be in any other dimension. In other words, yes, Lex could theoretically put Lex on Apokolips, but doing so would technically amp him too and Doom himself could just teleport into another plane. Not gonna start a cosmology debate between what’s superior between Gutterspace and the Sphere of the Gods but they’re not too explicitly different in the long run. Can Lex BFR Doom to the Source? Now that’s definitely a stretch. He could theoretically use any of the other abilities of the Motherbox, even if he hasn’t shown them yet, but like, even if we assume that he can, matter manipulation is something Doom can resist if not straight up say no to with an actuality shield. Phasing is contentious but Doom has resisted it from both Vision and once from a ghost using ectoplasm disruptors. Even if Lex could phase, Doom’s too durable to be taken out. From there, he could use the Flames of the Faltine to burn Lex to a crisp, freeze his story, rewrite his experience with the Prime Mover, or transport him out of the suit and then crush him with the Crimson Bands of Cyttorak. He resists hacking and his mindhax is strong enough to likely bypass Lex’s defenses if he really needs to.

In the end, it looks like Lex was simply doomed. The victor is Doctor Doom.